But the other GYBE albums are better.

It is underrated though. I thought I was the only fan of them on ILX.

i found it incredibly boring. My friend was listening to it and commented that it must have been quite easy to make. Maybe I haven’t listened to it close enough.

Isn’t Louis Jagger like 19?

don’t leave yourself open like that

ps the best instrumental record of all time is E2-E4

I liked it a lot but I haven’t listened to any GYBE in quite a while. I thought this and Fists were both really good in different ways. F#A#oo never did much for me.

deserves a place amongst the pantheon of Bach, Mozart, Davis, Orbital etc

Its a good job you wrote this in the sandbox, because you’d be really fucking embarrassed to see it revived in two years time.

I was kind of wondering what pantheon that was but just assumed it was a personal one.

louis this is your worst thread yet

ban gybe!

oh for bloody fuck cunts sake. stop picking on louis! i listened to this again today cos of this thread and it’s actually not that bad at all! it didn’t make me shit my pants with joy or anything but it was okay. old tossers, get off the internet and start playing outdoors for a little while.

ps i’m pretty durnk

I think it was a disappointing recording of stuff that sounded great live before they fucked around with it in the studio.

it’s a great record to listen to stoned, much like bach, mozart, davis and orbital.

The material all sounded fantastic at the QMU when I saw them.

louis this is your worst thread yet

— electric sound of jim (esoj@), December 3rd, 2006.

Entire Huge ILX Debates That Should Have Been Killed At Birth (paraphrase) was my worst, as any fule kno...

Also, Matt DC, I supply as a comparison four different if hugely influential, canonical, important, brilliant, generally-venerated composers of instrumental music and you claim that I’d be embarrassed? Elaborate, please.

comparing mozart to gybe to orbital is stupid

“comparisons are odious”

I wish I liked GYBE, I think I need more happening rhythmically. I lose interest after a while

i agree. when i went from liking being sad to liking rhythm i quit listening

dleone, otm here. it’s good but you have to be ready for repetition.

Also, Matt DC, I supply as a comparison four different if hugely influential, canonical, important, brilliant, generally-venerated composers of instrumental music and you claim that I’d be embarrassed? Elaborate, please.

Okay I’ll bite. I know you’ll be embarassed by them because *I* said similarly stupid things eight or nine years ago and I’m embarassed by them. Mercifully they weren’t archived on the internet for all eternity so yay I win.

Anyway, the reason its silly for you to lump GYBE in with Bach/Mozart/Miles Davis/Orbital is because there’s no reason to lump those four together other than the fact they’re generally venerated (Orbital possible exception) and they made instrumental music. Although the fact you’ve included Bach in there at all suggests you don’t actually know a huge amount about Bach. Or to a lesser extent Mozart.

So you’ve put GYBE in such exalted company mostly for instant gravitas, and then asked why they aren’t held in the same regard. Whereas the primary criticism levelled at GYBE is that they are all gravitas and no substance. They’re all Big Serious Face without the inventiveness or creativity to back it up. Because they make (or made) music specifically aimed at the type of listener to whom all you need are big crescendos and long silences and vague statements about religion and politics and making everything SLOW and SERIOUS for it to equal art. To be worthy of being named in the same breath as Mozart. Which incidentally is completely missing the point of Mozart as well.

And because their music is incredibly easy to make, and requires minimal invention or inspiration, whilst sounding Terribly Important. Unlike everyone else you’ve mentioned. And because they’re quite boring.

Alternatively, Tom E’s review of a completely different album still pwns them six years on.

i would like to say something stupid in teh other direction. they are quite simply: *much worse than tori amos*. louis, i hope that makes you feel better.

also based on the ONE song (ducks) of theirs i’ve heard, I wonder if they aren’t so much full of sound and f. yet signifying nothing etc. as for whatever reason assuming their audience were politically and emotionally numb/hard to reach? just remember feelign like iw as being hit over the head in about 17 different ways and that is COULD have been interesting possibly if simply more subtle yes.

I’d forgotten Tom’s article. Wow it is so great.

i wrote a positive review of one of their albums and then i never ever listened to them again. go figure!

http://www.villagevoice.com/music/0052,seward,21008,22.html

I’d put GYBE in the rubbish bin! SRSLY!

comparing mozart to gybe to orbital is stupid

I wasn’t comparing them to each other, musically at least; I was suggesting that the quality of GY!BE’s work compared favourably to the undoubted quality of the mentioned artists.

Right, onto Matt DC’s reply, much of which I wish to take him up upon.

Although the fact you’ve included Bach in there at all suggests you don’t actually know a huge amount about Bach. Or to a lesser extent Mozart. Yes, yes, the Cantatas, the Requiem, all of these have choral sections as well as orchestras. There’s no denying that both composers created great instrumental work as well, and moreover, the choral sections are mostly included for their harmonic and musical value rather than for the somewhat rote, hymnal words that they are singing, thus IMO making the pieces practically instrumental anyway.

Whereas the primary criticism levelled at GYBE is that they are all gravitas and no substance. They’re all Big Serious Face without the inventiveness or creativity to back it up. Your first sentence mentions a ‘primary criticism’. Mysteriously, your second sentence slips seamlessly into personal opinion (stated as fact), as if your opinion is identical to that of all GY!BE critics, who are all incontrovertibly correct. This would seem to me to be either a subjective flaw or an admission of one-sidedness, which is fair enough as long as it is acknowledged as just your own opinion and not the generally-held truth amongst the musical cognoscenti.

Because they make (or made) music specifically aimed at the type of listener to whom all you need are big crescendos and long silences and vague statements about religion and politics and making everything SLOW and SERIOUS for it to equal art. I have problems with ‘all you need’. I also have problems with ‘specifically aimed’ and ‘making everything SLOW and SERIOUS for it to equal art’. I also have problems with ‘long silences’, and ‘vague statements about religion and politics’. In fact, this entire extract is flawed. I shall explain. GY!BE have probably made music much like other worthy bands have made music: they’re trying to plough an original, interesting furrow (sorry, lazy journalistic metaphor but we’ll let that slide), and they’re probably not making music with anything other than their own ideas in mind. Perhaps, however, their music is more appreciable to (rather than specifically aimed at) the sorts of people who...well, the ‘type’ of listener who enjoys all of the things you mention? Listeners come in types now, do they? I like to think that listeners appreciate anything musical as long as it is done well within the right context. Big crescendos can be boring or sublime, as can long silences, and as for vague statements about religion and politics, well, remove the ‘vague’ and you’ve got yourself a whole load of genius and a whole load of shite out there in the music world. In the context of GY!BE’s album Yanqui U.X.O, which has been the subject of my argument throughout, even then your claims are misguided. They read, as Tom’s excellent review does, as a criticism more of Lift Your Skinny Fists..., which I myself regard as flawed for much the same reasons as Tom does. There are big crescendos in YUXO, but they are more abruptly-reached, more instantly crushing, and more momentous than those which cropped up every so often in the previous album. There are also no words in the album, hence no statements on religion or politics. You’ll have to refer to the cover-art for that (although it’s still not specifically about religion or politics, more about the relations between record companies and arms manufacturers, and the destruction that these arms are still creating in the world at large, which is a noble enough cause IMO despite the slightly melodramatic means of presenting it). As for ‘making everything SLOW and SERIOUS for it to equal art’, jeez, these guys have their own way(s) of displaying their creative talents, and just because theirs involves ‘slow’ (perhaps) and ‘serious’ (subjective) instrumentation, does this mean that they automatically make a claim to be of higher artistic worth than, say, a speed-punk group? Nope, it’s just your own reaction to the music. Were you to think ‘This is slow, this is long, this sounds quite dramatic...’ but then continue with ‘...however, something like The Locust’s ‘Plague Soundscapes’ (20 minutes, 21 tracks of hyper-fast electronic hardcore) is more of a serious attempt to create High Art’, that would be no less valuable a statement than yours that long and slow equals pomposity. Everyone has their own ways of working, and it is your conditioning that has caused this unfair conflation.

Which incidentally is completely missing the point of Mozart as well. uh

And because their music is incredibly easy to make, and requires minimal invention or inspiration, whilst sounding Terribly Important. Unlike everyone else you’ve mentioned. And because they’re quite boring. This is all subjective, again. You can’t claim to win this argument over me by your divine right as a Music Critic to bestow final judgement. Why, if their music is so easy to make, does nobody else (except a few plagiarists and/or labelmates who share some of their bandmembers) sound anything like them? Fair enough that some of their chords and scales might be simple to conceive of or play, but nobody else has presented them in such a manner as they: the difficulty is in the conception rather than the execution. YUXO is chock-full of little twists and turns, little details only picked up after several listens, that create a simply awesome listening experience, unburdened by thoughts such as ‘I could play that arpeggio in my sleep!’. Their having ‘minimal invention or inspiration’ is what you believe, but it is not what I believe. It is fair enough if you think less of me as a listener (as the ‘type’ who likes long, slow, boring music) because of this, but you cannot dispute my right to defend it. The sounds, the production, the movements; they might not be as note-stuffed as a good recording of Bach, Mozart or Davies, or a decent Orbital album, but they are IMO brilliantly-conceived as a coherent, thought-provoking whole, whose effect upon me is unlike any other record. We’ve already established that ‘Terribly Important’ is your own ad hominem assault upon music that dares to stretch things out a little, and in fact I could well say that Miles Davis’ stupid whiny look-at-me-jazz-hands trumpet noise pisses me off just as much (I won’t, though). And oh yeah, they’re boring. For some.

Let’s face it, your reply is mired in the sort of music-journalist cliche and subjective holier-than-thou pronouncement that we really ought to be avoiding on here. Before you snap back, accusing me of being similarly guilty (although liking YUXO isn’t exactly a cliche), let me say that all of the parts I labelled as ‘subjective’ in your post are entirely A-OK by me. Mine are the same. However, you seem to think that yours are the law. I asked this question originally with a view to having an interesting, detailed discussion of the record’s pros and cons, of a fair-minded appraisal, but all you have come up with is the party line. And what a (cough) self-important, boring, Big Serious Face party line it is.

wtf

you could try reading it first, phil, before saying ‘ooh, it’s long, it’s therefore probably really self-important and boring’.

see what i did there?

I did read it, “Louis”.

Verdict? Really self-important and boring!

i am truly touched, esteban. *cowers behind desk*

Godspeed You! Boring Cunt

not even the correct acronym, esteban. very poor indeed.

godspeed you! blundering eejit?

[/rising to bait]

no dynam9ics

I assumed you were joking w/ that Mozart thing and fully intended to jump in and say so once I had read the whole thing. Then I continued scrolling down and it all went terribly wrong

As for Godspeed!, them and Primal Scream are the definition of ‘did I change or was it you’ with regard to my taste in music. I could still throw on ‘Slow Riot’ now and it would be a blast, but not this one, which felt flat to me even when I was still a pretty big fan

that Mozart thing

What Mozart thing?

“deserves a place amongst the pantheon of Bach, Mozart, Davis, Orbital etc etc etc”

That wasn’t the main constituent of my argument ffs! It was an admittedly crass, naive generalisation (hence the ‘etc etc etc’) designed merely to give some context to my regard of this GY!BE album, not to act as some sort of argumentative pivot around which my words would stand or fall!

Plenty of you, however, are using this as a means to attack me. It’s sly, unkind and entirely beside the point.

?

Meantime, I never tire of telling the story of how GYBE caused me to fall asleep at a show of theirs — when I was only six feet away from the stage. STANDING UP.

oh for bloody fuck cunts sake. stop picking on louis! i listened to this again today cos of this thread and it’s actually not that bad at all! it didn’t make me shit my pants with joy or anything but it was okay. old tossers, get off the internet and start playing outdoors for a little while.

I like this and agree with it. Though, I couldn’t give a toss about the band.

Remeber this ditty from Regina Spektor? Caused a 300 post shitstorm as I recall but can’t find a link......

“The thing that blew my mind first hearing the Strokes was that they were the closest I had heard rock come to classical,” she says. “Their music is extraordinarily orderly and composed. It’s almost like Mozart.”

God Peed You! Bladder Excretion

louis i think most people’s problem with your claim was not that you were comparing GY!BE to bach or mozart or miles or orbital but that you claimed the existence of a single “pantheon” containing all the greats of “instrumental music”—implying that the major division amongst musics for most people is “music with singing” and “music without singing” and that everyone in the second category can be lumped together as though they have more in common with one another than they do with those from their same time who make music from the first category.

So essentially Louis, what you’re saying to me is a very long variation on “that’s just your opinion”, right?

In fact, it isn’t my opinion, nor was it intended to be my opinion. It was intended to be a summary of a lot of anti-GYBE criticism as I see it and why in that regard comparing them to Mozart might actually undermine your defence of them. So yes, of course it was a party line. It was meant to be a friendly pointer so seriously, calm down. You won’t destroy the pompous critical consensus like that.

My opinion on GYBE—liked them at the time, haven’t wanted to listen to them once in 5 years, had more or less lost interest by the time Yanqui UXO came out, suspect I would find them very boring now.

(I’d like to take you up on the astonishing wrongness of your Bach argument but suspect that would hardly be constructive at this point)

2 things.

First, I think that if Godspeed! You Bl!ack Emperor! would’ve named themselves something bland and neutral like, say, Montreal Orchestra, and stayed away from political statements and refusing to do interviews and publicity, 95% of the arguments and controversy around them would disappear. It’s the name, mainly, I think. It’s the the type that grabs your attention immediately, and then either you’re sort of intrigued by it or you just think it’s fucking stupid and the band has to justify their existence from that point on.

Secondly, I don’t agree with the argument that GYBE’s music is “easy to make”. Stars of the Lid and plenty of other ambient musicians have long sections of music involving only one note, and then fucking around with the reverb and equalizer settings. Autechre has been accused of letting their algorithms do all the work for them in certain songs/albums. But no one would never suggest that what they do is easy. If it was easy to do, they wouldn’t be (in my opinion) the leaders in that respective genres.

The same holds true with GYBE, I think. True, they stuck with the “quiet sections with crazy street vendor/street preacher rambling on” trick for a bit too long, but, then, a lot of bands have been accused of using the same gimmick for too long. And while people used to express annoyance at Stereolab and Low for not changing their sound enough from album to album, there was never this strange spew of vitriol that always comes out when GYBE is the subject. Perhaps because Stereolab isn’t called Stereolab Dawn of Exquisite Light Orchestra w/ La dee Da Da Orchestra?

Incidentally, I only heard Yanqui UXO once, and wasn’t all that impressed with it, but I think I’ve had enough time away from it to give it a good second listen.

Now I’m going to read Tom’s review linked to above and regret everything I just said.

I wasn’t comparing them to each other, musically at least; I was suggesting that the quality of GY!BE’s work compared favourably to the undoubted quality of the mentioned artists.

That’s like comparing Aaron McGruder to Toni Morrison and suggesting you’re talking about good writers.

Seems to me louis is onto something we’ve all gone through. Right now, for him, this album is the Greatest Album In The World (or at least the Greatest Instrumental Album In The World). These come and go all the time. I can’t imagine how many of these have gone through my life. I probably don’t even own half of them anymore. Today, I wouldn’t say Dinosaur’s Green Mind is pedestal-worthy, but twelve years ago (or whenever it came out, I can’t be bothered to go look) I listened to it every single day for months on end. It captured a moment that was, at the time, Significant. Was it more important to me at that Significant moment in time than Miles Davis or Mozart or Galaxie 500, or the Stone Roses or whatever else that I now consider to be pantheon- or pedatal-worthy? Of course. I’m not going to say that now I know better, cuz, I mean, there’s a bunch of stuff I love today that I won’t love this time next year let alone next week.

I remember an anniversay issue of Spin magazine where they named the 100 greatest singles of all time. Number one was Rob Base’s “It Takes Two” over the Stones and Marvin Gaye and the Kinks and Velvet Undergound and every other song ever released. The obvious point: whatever is the best thing to you right fucking now is the best thing of all fucking time. In sum, enjoy it.

The VU had singles?

The VU had singles?

Yep.

This is a classic example of ILM gang-throwing-the-band-over-the-shark.

Wrong album Louis, come on, even the band thought it was shitly recorded. GYBE were a formula band, and yes, their shit was relatively simple, and no, they’re nothing like classical music (except maybe Branca who they ripped off heavily, tho that’s not necessarily a problem)... I still like their first two albums, tho they are now deeply uncool. Except, so it would seem, with a lot of metallers who edge ever more closer to Godspeed with more metal, basically.

Hmm, I think there’s a pretty big world outside ILM where they’re not at all ‘uncool’, although it’s something of a moot point given that their last record was over four years ago

Meantime, I never tire of telling the story of how GYBE caused me to fall asleep at a show of theirs — when I was only six feet away from the stage. STANDING UP. Yeah, well I briefly dozed off the first time I watched Hamlet. Still the best play I’ve ever seen (with the exception of Noises Off).

louis i think most people’s problem with your claim was not that you were comparing GY!BE to bach or mozart or miles or orbital but that you claimed the existence of a single “pantheon” containing all the greats of “instrumental music”—implying that the major division amongst musics for most people is “music with singing” and “music without singing” and that everyone in the second category can be lumped together as though they have more in common with one another than they do with those from their same time who make music from the first category. This is fair. If only that were most people’s qualm...although in my defence I have seen threads on ‘instrumental music’ bandied around before here. Perhaps I should have limited it to instrumental rock music. Music without lyrics is more the issue here than music without singing, incidentally, which takes us onto...

I’d like to take you up on the astonishing wrongness of your Bach argument but suspect that would hardly be constructive at this point. *gulps* Please, don’t be too harsh, I just hear the voices and think ‘harmony’! I don’t know any German! I don’t know what they’re singing! For me it’s just another musical strand to add to the other factions of the orchestra.

As for the rest of your point, Matt, well, even if that isn’t your opinion, you yourself have claimed that it’s a pretty generally-held opinion on GY!BE. In that case, my words stand, although if I can’t take down the critical consensus that way, how on earth could I ever do so?

That’s like comparing Aaron McGruder to Toni Morrison and suggesting you’re talking about good writers. Sadly, American Studies isn’t part of the course I’m on. Although Toni Morrison, she wrote Beloved, didn’t she? One of the other classes at school studied that and hated it practically to a man (and woman). So...you’re saying that all the artists named are shite? Uh?

Right now, for him, this album is the Greatest Album In The World Not even close. Maybe top 25. ;-)

Greatest Instrumental Album In The World One of. :-D Although we could clarify that again with ‘Instrumental Rock’.

even the band thought it was shitly recorded. SEE ALSO: The Beta Band, s/t. Another favourite of mine, despite whatever they thought it could have been. The artist, if not dead, is definitely bound and gagged in the corner by the time his creation reaches my ears. I think it’s recorded fantastically.

they’re nothing like classical music Never said they were.

Branca who they ripped off heavily Have heard Symphony No. 6 and The Ascension, similarities in guitar tone perhaps, complete disparity in terms of melodic ambition.

deeply uncool SO FUCKING WHAT

deeply uncool SO FUCKING WHAT

OTM, sheesh. That was almost as bad as anything Louis said.

Louis Jagger: “I’m too stupid to use Wikipedia”

This tit-for-tat arguing of points of little relevancy is really dorky, Louis. Is this your signature or something?

Although Toni Morrison, she wrote Beloved, didn’t she? One of the other classes at school studied that and hated it practically to a man (and woman). So...you’re saying that all the artists named are shite? Uh?

ban louis jagger

Is Louis one of those guys like Nude Spock who has 5 million logins?

xpost: ‘relevancy’

;-)

no, i have one login, but i change the name/email depending upon what sort of mood i’m in.

The smiley police are going to come and pry the parentheses keys offa your keyboard, Louis.

This tit-for-tat arguing of points I’m simply upholding my right to respond to those who otherwise unanswered will claim undeserved victory over me. :-D

:-D contains no parentheses, btw.

i have no opinion on godspeed you blah blah but toni morrison is really amazing, louis, and you should read her stuff! beloved is the ‘classic’ but i think you might like paradise better. or the bluest eye.

You’re all forgetting one thing: Miles Davis’ stupid whiny look-at-me-jazz-hands trumpet noise.

Victory?

Miles Davis’ stupid whiny look-at-me-jazz-hands trumpet noise. Yeah, awful, isn’t it... :p

As for that jpg, taking semi-amusing pot-shots over the internet ain’t much better!

i still want to see the movie they’re named for

God Speed You! Black Emperor (ゴッド・スピード・ユー! BLACK EMPEROR) is a little known 1976 Japanese black-and-white 16 mm documentary film, 91 minutes long, by director Mitsuo Yanagimachi, which follows the exploits of a Japanese biker gang, the Black Emperors. The 1970’s Japan saw the rise of biker gangs, known as bōsōzoku, and drew interest by the media. The movie follows a member of the bike gang and how he interacts with his parents after getting in trouble with the police.

i wrote a positive review of one of their albums and then i never ever listened to them again. go figure!

http://www.villagevoice.com/music/0052,seward,21008,22.html

— scott seward (skotro...), December 3rd, 2006.

so, scott, was a permanent weed detox the reason for never listening to “skinny fists” again?

The material all sounded fantastic at the QMU when I saw them.

whoof. i remember seeing them at the QMU a good few years back and thinking they were the most tedious spectacle imaginable. up until that point i’d really, really liked them; after that i couldn’t bear to listen to them again. (same thing happened—perhaps more understandably—with the polyphonic spree.)

that said: they’re long overdue an official grimly fiendish re-assessment. and, now i’ve got my record-player working again, i shall get to it.

The smiley police are going to come and pry the parentheses keys offa your keyboard, Louis.

It would only be fair to get Ned’s keyboard too, then.

I think it was a disappointing recording of stuff that sounded great live before they fucked around with it in the studio.

The most OTM thing on this thread.

“Beloved” is amazing but Morrison has written at least 4 books better than that one.

if that is so then they must be like the best 4 books ever

cuz beloved was pretty fucking good

lfam is Oprah and I claim my $10

I think it was a disappointing recording of stuff that sounded great live before they fucked around with it in the studio.

But didn’t Albini record Yanqui U.X.O.? And doesn’t he normally just record the band pretty much as they normally sound live, sans wild production techniques?

indeed he did

better than beloved IMO

“Paradise”

“Song Of Solomon”

“The Bluest Eye”

&, her best and most recent book: “Love”.

damn, i think i actually like “Jazz” more too.

louis have you been getting your classical music info from geir

i have never listened to it. but i bought the vinyl for $1 at housing works and resold it to other music for $8 store credit last week.

just thought i’d share that.

i’m not homeless or anything, i actually do quite well for myself. but i was enjoying a long walk and that was the direction i was going in.

Well you shoud appreciate it for $7 worth of your time then.

I didn’t mind them when they were used in the soundtrack for 28 Days Later, but I can’t imagine ever wanting to listen to them again. I can’t argue with their live sound... With all 8–9 people sawing away it was pretty dang impressive, but they desperately needed some kind of random element to shake them out of the predictable loud-soft-loud-shortwave voice-soft-loud routine. The closest they got was when the Labradford guys joined them on stage for one piece, but that was about it.

Anyway, that last Scenic album craps all over the entire GYBE output.

back when i was just discovering indie music, i kept trying hard to appreciate the “genius” of this band, but i just couldn’t stand to listen to the shit for more than 5 minutes. ned’s anecdote = otm.

One trick ponies, but when they got it right on F#A#~ a prety impressive trick. Just needed Scott Walker to sing on it and it would have been pretty much perfect.

Having said that nowhere near as good as ‘It takes two’.

Once again Louis is guilty of having the enthusiasm and frame of reference of a nineteen year old rather than the cynicism and frame of reference of a thirty year old.

Enthusiasm is great.

Southall is correct!

Louis enthusiasm deserves a place amongst the pantheon of Scrappy Doo, Mr Motivator, Ainsley Harriot and Orbital.

I think this one has LEGS.

You’re very weird these days, Dom.

these days = 1986–2006

Is that the title of the new Bon Jovi Best Of?

Ned, weren’t you also jet-lagged and sleep-deprived that night?

Jet-lagged, no. A bit sleepless, yes, but come the fuck on — you’d think a bunch as *loud* as them would actually do better. Elvis Telecom was at the same show I was and his description says it all.

xpost: the funny thing is, paranoid android is just right at 6:20. I can’t actually imagine extending it with any real reward unless you change the tone of the entire song.

exit music would have been an amazing 8-minute song.

marmot hath zung

graham coxon’s “innovative” guitar playing basically just meant that he was the only one of those doodz who listened to U.S. 90s indie rock.

what us 90’s indie rock guitar playing is the last three minutes of ’1992’ ripped from then? or like ALL of Battle?

marmot hath zung

I’m listening to my neglected copy of Blur right now because of you and rather enjoying it, so it’s all good.

I listened to Trouble in the Message Centre; He Thought of Cars and Yuko and Hiro. Though I’ve gone back to listening to Neil Diamond and Justin Hayward since then.

Listening to songs because they were discussed on ILM: C/D?

*puts Yuko And Hiro on*

oh, the power of suggestion

i’ve never heard that song louis. but i’ll have to say it was probably stolen from railroad jerk. or girl against boys.

“You’re So Great” is nearly a dead-on mid-’90s GbV rip. Only other thing they could have done was to not have used a slide on the guitar solo and called it “Airplanes Flying Me Backwards” or something.

essex dogs apparently bears some resemblance to sonic youth, but aside from the fact that the guitar sounds are quite dissonant/raucous, and the spoken-word free-verse, i can’t really make the leap. care to take that one on, marmot?

Nah it doesn’t really sound like SY to me.

Slint with more fiddly shit?

hmm, ugh. but do you like it? (THIS IS CRUCIAL AS TO WHETHER I SHALL EVER SPEAK TO YOU ON ILM AGAIN) ;-)

louis this is your worst thread yet

— electric sound of jim (esoj@), December 3rd, 2006.

qft

i think the sandbox has made people lose their sense of decorum

just because there aren’t amusing wrestler gifs every other post and/or the prevalence of ILM’s bully brigade waxing flatulent over some pathetic, outdated meme, doesn’t mean you can fling yourself into the paddling-pool and spoil our innocent fun, passantino.

I like the song fine, Louis. It doesn’t sound much like Slint either, I just don’t know that much ’90s indie with quiet spoken vocals. I was a GbV/Pavement/Flaming Lips/Mercury Rev guy.

Oh, and Chavez since Matt brought them up. I still have vinyl copies of their first 7“ and LP.

early Rev? mid-period Lips? *eyes light up*

the Rev’s first two albums are up in my top 20 of the decade, and a conglomerate best-of would have made top-3.

just think...

1) MOARK

2) Chasing A Bee

3) Syringe Mouth

4) Downs Are Feminine Balloons

5) Trickle Down

6) Black And Blue

7) Something For Joey

8) Snorry Mouth

9) Hi-Speed Boats

10) Frittering

11) one of the drunks/thunder interludes

12) Very Sleepy Rivers

as i said, i’m buying chavez’ entirety. looking forward immensely to it.

“death of the party” is an attempt at a ’90s version of “how soon is now?”, too.

correction: 6) Blue And Black

death of a party and how soon is now share a bit where the guitar plays a high note and then slides down about a semitone, but that aside i can’t see the similarity.

actually, without the drunks/thunder interlude it comes to 79:24, which is just about as much music as you can fit on a CD. that album would be incredible.

early Rev? mid-period Lips? *eyes light up*

I also own like 3 CDs each of The Mars Volta, GYBE and Yes but don’t get too excited.

My favorite Rev bit is actually the flutey outro of Empire State.

*physically restrains self*

Of course, if your Yes albums are ‘Drama’, ’90125’ and ‘Tormato’ my vigour shall be somewhat deflated...

See You On The Other Side is a shameful omission from my collection. I’ve heard it a couple of times, and it’s pretty good, but for it to click I need to buy a copy.

The Yes Album, Fragile, Close To The Edge...oh, and a CD-R of Relayer.

SYOTOS is the first Rev album I owned as a kid, that’s probably why it’s my favorite. I actually wanted Boces since I had only heard “Car Wash Hair”, “Bronx Cheer” and “Young Man’s Stride” and liked BC the best but SYOTOS was all they had at the shop, it had just come out. “Bronx Cheer” is still my favorite of their short, poppy singles stuff.

re: Yes albums, OTM! (but it was always going to be!)

oh to have been a kid in the early-90’s...

Bahahaha if you Google “See You On The Other Side” now you get a bunch of links to a 2005 Korn album.

this is really sweet, you guys : )

yeah hey Louis I like Mogwai too, wanna cyber?

go on then! shall see if messenger thingy still working

thing is, dude was screwing his marmot

hahahahahaha

oh waht it was only a meme :-(

I’ve not got the time or inclination to deal with this bizarre dying horse of a thread, but somewhere up there someone said that a; Radiohead have great production, and b; their songwriting communicates something emotionally that Blur don’t. These points are both utterly ridiculous. Radiohead are Floyd for Nirvana fans with degrees, and Blur wrote To The End, The Universal, Beetlebum and This Is A Low, three more emotionally resonant songs than Thom Yorke could ever concoct.

balls. emotional resonance is in the wonky eye of the beholder.

Of course, which is why to suggest that Blur have none is patently ridiculous. Also, more emotions exist than faint existential ennui / paranoia.

seriously, what does it matter if something’s easy/difficult to make.
YA RLY. Ramones? FUCK THAT SHIT! DREAM THEATER!!!!

Uh, yes, yes, that really does prove your point.

And also why it’s ridiculous to suggest Blur have more emotional resonance than Radiohead

xpost

God I hate The Universal so much. Enough Andrew Lloyd Webber already.

Really? I’m surprised. I think it’s one of Blur’s best tunes, easily.

Also, more emotions exist than faint existential ennui / paranoia.

Yes, obviously those are the only two things Radiohead do because it’s so easy to say... *burp* scratch... can’t be bothered anymore. You say subjective I say potato.

There’s a horrendous sense of schmaltz in Blur ballads that sets my teeth on end, and that’s the worst culprit. I don’t like To The End much for the same reason.

I don’t actually like Blur very much at all but I find the ballads accentuate the things I hate about them more than the others. Bearing in mind I’ve listened to Blur more than pretty much any other band I dislike.

Haha! Well obviously I’m playing deliberately reductive devil’s advocate. I do think though that Blur have a wider emotional palette than Radiohead—I don’t think Radiohead could ever do something that moves me in the way that “Girls & Boys” or “Song 2” do, and I think those emotional directions are just as, if not more, profound and worthwhile than the kind of thing that Radiohead seem to get lauded for. I’m not saying I think Blur are better or anything—I’m not mad keen on either band, I just quite like them both—but I think rubbishing Blur’s emotional resonance is silly.

x-post.

Hey I DON’T MIND BLUR (for the third time)

anyway for “emotional resonance” Coffee and TV >>>>>>>>>> To The End, Beetlebum and This Is A Low. NOT THAT THEY AREN’T ALSO QUITE NICE SONGS, And I totally hate The Universal too.

What was that lead single off “Think Tank” btw? If that wasn’t Blur-doing-Radiohead (pretty damn well) I don’t know what was.

‘Out Of Time’ wasn’t as good as Radiohead tho. I’m still amazed it made the ILM 00s top 100 2 years back (and more amazed that i managed to think of something ‘good’ to say about it).

“Out Of Time” sounds bog-all like radiohead to me?!

Radiohead just don’t do grating (sometimes in a good way, sometimes “Crazy Beat”) pop songs... and aren’t really a pop band.

Thom Yorke for all his faults (hell I was saying they rely on the same kind of song far too often myself before) annoys me a million times less that Damon Albarn, who pushes my “fuck off twat” button nearly every time he opens his mouth.

WANK TANK—CALL IT BY ITS NAME.

Ah, you see I have much more time for damon than for Thom.

Blur, up to “Parklife” were pretty much unstoppable, after that, eh. There seems to be some kind of mental block w/britishes bands, post-eighties where as soon as it looks like they’re really going to take off musically & in terms of greater “success” generally, they have to pull on the brakes in some way, it seems maybe? I have no idea what the fuck I’m on about obv. Radiohead are OK, but nothing I have by them I like as much as “Parklife” or “Modern Life is Rubbish”. Then again, neither of those records I like as much as Dark Star’s “20 20 Sound” or Levitation’s “Need for Not” and “Coterie” from around the same time ish.

xpost—I admire both of them fine and yeah Damon’s probably stretched his imagination a lot further than Thom ever will if that makes you happy/vindicated? That alone doesn’t make me warm to Blur anymore though. It’s a bit apple & orangey this...

it’s the enthusiasm of a 19-yr-old (which is great!), but not the frame of reference! i have said this before, but what i really don’t get about louis is that the stuff he says these things about is the stuff people my age and a bit older would have eulogised when they were louis’ age! i am pretty sure that most 19-yr-olds do not listen to mansun or blur or godspeed whatsit. people who are 25 did, when they were 19.

HAHA! This coming from you Lex is... is.. I dunno. I know you weren’t being mean here but being baffled by Louis’s taste baffles me since (as far as I’m concerned) your taste is more in line with that of a 14 year old girl than a 20 something bloke. ;-)

14 year old girls listen to Dominik Eulberg?

14 year old Lex was listening to...Blur!

14-yr-old lex was listening to tori amos, pj harvey, tricky, bjork, massive attack, portishead, moloko, madonna and lisa germano. certainly not blur, or at least only tangentially. i stand by them all :D

oh yeah and fiona apple :D

You are incorrects. The greatest all times greatest instrumental album is Songs For Birds by Kenneth Gee, whose melodics, limpid flute artistry makes birds fly and was major influence on contemporary epic melodics Greenland rock band Sick Of Ross.

perhaps my 10 suggestions upthread were inappropriate

they seemed purposefully achingly obscure but i am sure they are all very excellent.

this thread at some point suddenly became pretty damn enjoyable, once we got off the godspeed and the bach.

my final pronouncement on blur: the universal is a slightly sappy song with a GREAT lyrical theme, to the end is I agree one of their worst (musically uninteresting), this is a low is brilliant, as is beetlebum.

my best of blur, representative of what I like about them: 1) beetlebum 2) bugman 3) slow down 4) blue jeans 5) 1992 6) ambulance 7) he thought of cars 8) on your own 9) caravan 10) trouble in the message centre 11) battle 12) caramel 13) this is a low 14) resigned 15) essex dogs 16) yuko & hiro

Unfortunately none of these does not qulify because they are not instrumentals.

well, now we are back at blur once again and away from anything we don’t already know i guess we can all go home and dribble down our chins

heh! i don’t know half of those blur songs myself

he made half of them up

DARK SIDE OF THE ALBARN

‘Optigan #1’—so crap they had to launch it into space!

optigan #1 was the closing track on 13, the beagle one was a different song completely (that never got played due to rubbish mars landing) :-(

i like optigan one!

this thread at some point suddenly became pretty damn enjoyable, once we got off the godspeed and the bach.

yeah, after you and lex turned this into some fucking teen magazine profile feature piece wankfest about how a british virgin — SHOCKAH — acquired unusual taste in music, yeah, it got a lot more “damn enjoyable.”

mickey, how do you keep an idiot in suspense?

How’s your legal case, Mickey?

pwn3d

the suspense is killing me!

I think the idea that there were going to be 283 posts about the merits of GYBE’s last album on a thread started by *anyone* is a little fanciful

sick mouthy, over.

Good. Now kindly explain what anyone’s level of sexual experience has to do with anything.

i like the song the universal.

virgins find other outlets to satisfy themselves (as do other people, but virgins especially). sometimes called hobbies. when this happens to somebody with music, they tend to acquire unusual tastes.

what a fucking shockah! now let’s all gush like lex over how fantastic this is.

tevs asshole!

“fantastic” is not the word i would have chosen. also i would’ve hazarded a guess that mickey was also a virgin but i guess jail or whatever would solve that

Sexual experience precludes hobbies. Just in adolescence and early adulthood or throughout a whole life? What about married audiophiles with $200k hi-fis, or fishermen, or anything? Once you’ve had sex you can’t be arsed with culture or interests anymore so you just watch bad evening TV when not having sex?

the RIAA come round and bum you personally

my life’s been downhill all the way since i got laid

as if those questions need to be answered. go ahead and pretend there’s no correlation between teenage virginity and passionate, time consuming hobbies. we were both teenage virgins once, nick.

Speak for yourself. I’m from Devon and had several pet dogs as a child.

ok truce

teenage virginity and passionate, time consuming hobbies

Which explains why I’m posting here a lot. Er.

you incurable romantic

you incurable fanromantic

even if i had popped my cherry in some sordid broom-cupboard tryst with some desperate, eyeliner-caked harridan that lasted about as long as it took me to realise that this was a fucking bad idea, i’d still listen to and emjoy all the wonderful music i’ve accumulated.

furthermore, my taste REALLY isn’t that unusual. in the context of ILM it’s actually quite mainstream! :-)

*enjoy

emjoy: the joy of em

that lasted about as long as it took me to realise that this was a fucking bad idea

you’ll never get any with that attitude

well, i’m an incurable romantic* too! it has to be right, with that special someone...

*wuss

The Universal is truly awful. I had that song on a mixtape I used to drive around to in high school. I thought it was great back then, of course (hence inclusion on mixtape).

I remember it being named in a “songs with great verses, awful chorus” thread. OTM. String city!

I put on Yanqui UXO last night. I have to say it’s held up really well. I’m surprised there are complaints about the production since I think it’s great, really clear with a lot of detail and dynamics. And I’m not even that big of an Albini fan normally. Dominique, I wonder if you’ve heard this album. It’s not really complex or intricate rhythmically but it does have more of a pulse or dare I say groove (in an indie kind of way) than other GYBE. I like the layers of sound, especially when there is high-end noise ringing over the track. I’d want to listen more before I go into more detail.

(I don’t have much to say about Blur though.)

well, i’m an incurable romantic* too! it has to be right, with that special someone...
*wuss

Yeah, I thought that too. When real ILX is back you can read the hideous story of how it did happen, replete with vomit.

Louis have ye heard that Scott Walker album? Just out of curiosity...

I’ve just remembered that my virginity story is doubly amusing because the soundtrack was F# A# (Infinity) by Godspeed. Ha and indeed ha.

Louis have ye heard that Scott Walker album? Just out of curiosity...

— Da Mystery of Sandboxin’ (...), December 7th, 2006.

Which? I have ‘Clara’ and ‘Cue’ off the latest one (Clara is incredible, brilliant etc), and I have recently bought ‘Tilt’, although I’m finding that kinda tough to get into (The Cockfighter is great though!). It’ll come!

Also, a little bird, possibly known as Matt DC, may have warned me in person earlier this evening that if Dan Perry were to find this thread, my Bach and Mozart claims would be rinsed, dried and stone-baked within fifteen milliseconds. Dan, if you’re reading this, you win. :-)