Magazine/website/record store BEST OF 2011 end-of-year list pile-up

everything's a free download on the internet nowadays

dog latin how many of the metal hammer list have you heard?

im surprised uncle acid and the deadbeats missed out on both Kerrang and Metal Hammers lists

xxp ha yeah I get the impression that a lot of writers are still getting to grips w/ the idea of *normal listeners* being able to lawfully acquire albums for free

JR: none of 'em. woops! i was interested to hear the arabrot album though. oh i think i've scraped the surface of the opeth record. seriously, i only listen to a minutiae of the amount of metal i used to - this is mostly due to who i live with and who i hang out with these days as opposed to anything else.

dog latin is getting old!

(This is where JR and I have ~differences~ but I am really uncomfortable with the way that "Metal" has been raised to that position of automatic rockist privilege that "Indie" used to occupy 20 years ago, now that "Indie" has become completely mainstream. But this is challops and I know it.)

also i think it's perfectly legit to call out grown-ass professional critics who privilege indie-r&b and either dismiss or don't bother with much else (as opposed to just casual listeners, who - sigh - can listen to what they want, as long as they don't make stupid arguments for it to me à la the above)

― degas-dirty monet (lex pretend), Thursday, 15 December 2011 12:02 (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Permalink

This isn't particular to r'n'b either, but it's just the way things are for a lot of genres outside the general pop/rock domain. For some reason Mastodon became the go-to metal band for non-metal critics to write about a while back. They're a good band, but are they THE BEST? Probably not. Then you've got Liturgy - a black metal band who dress as hipsters - and as you can imagine they have SCORN poured over them by so-called "true" black metal types who see them as an insult to their traditions. But is it bad that Liturgy (who I haven't heard yet, but understand are pretty good) get reviewed in Pitchfork, but not Weakling? I wouldn't say it's fair but if it means indie kids might be tempted to check out a bit of metal for a change, then I'm all for it.

dog latin is getting old!

― Minga Frump (Jimmy Riddle), Thursday, 15 December 2011 12:14 (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Permalink

Yes, yes. Also to do with getting to listen to music for a maximum of 2-3 hours a day on weekdays, and wanting to cram as much in as possible. And having a girlfriend who's studying, neighbours and paper-thin-walls etc. I hate listening to metal quietly, so it ends up being placed on the back burner. A real shame!

I know metal encompasses a variety of styles but interesting that it gets lists of 50 and over from its dedicated mags. Anything else with the same monolithic label (hip-hop, country, dance/electronic, even 'indie' lol) had lists that extensive from dedicated channels (may be examples upthread that i missed)?

This is where JR and I have ~differences~ but I am really uncomfortable with the way that "Metal" has been raised to that position of automatic rockist privilege that "Indie" used to occupy 20 years ago, now that "Indie" has become completely mainstream.

Huh?

I like Liturgy a lot and have listened to as much black metal this year as almost anything else but I don't think you could get me to actually care about black metal 'culture' being 'belittled' if you put a gun to my head

Yes, it's absolute bollocks isn't it? If the music's good, why complain?

also Weakling are kind of indie-friendly as the genre goes, P4K would prolly write about them if they reformed tomorrow tbh

xp it's not so much that as 'what a disaster for a bunch of mostly white male self-proclaimed misanthropes'

Well, I think it's also because BM fans don't see why Liturgy should be given the upper hand just because they dress in casual clothes. I can imagine there's also a sentiment of tokenism here, Liturgy appealing to "in it for a minute" fans, or whatever.

Then you've got Liturgy - a black metal band who dress as hipsters - and as you can imagine they have SCORN poured over them by so-called "true" black metal types who see them as an insult to their traditions. But is it bad that Liturgy (who I haven't heard yet, but understand are pretty good) get reviewed in Pitchfork, but not Weakling? I wouldn't say it's fair but if it means indie kids might be tempted to check out a bit of metal for a change, then I'm all for it.

yeah Liturgy are scorned by some for his 'essays' and youtube videos.
Weakling probably preceded pitchfork hence no coverage.

I'm so out of touch...

you should hang out in metal threads then
and get a pair of headphones

NY resolution IMO

Okay, Katy B is no 2 in the Guardian list and presumably PJ Harvey is no 1.

is that predictable for the guardian?

I suggest we stop thinking of genres and concentrate on artists instead. Questions of taxonomy are impossible to answer. Lots of listeners don't consider Lady Antebellum and Taylor Swift country. Artists shape genres, not the other way around.

Many years ago, knowing little about traditional R&B other than what I heard on the radio, I bought a Luther Vandross comp -- a perfect gateway. Then I bought artists similar to Vandross. Soon whatever I considered "R&B" sounded accessible -- I "got it," so to speak.

My favorite R&B album of the year: Marsha Ambrosius' Late Nights & Early Mornings. Seek it out!

is that predictable for the guardian?

I don't know, but it's a way less boring result than it could have been.

KATY B!

it was predictable for me but that's cuz i knew who else was voting and what their tastes were (which is why i was certain that beyoncé would be top 10, too). i imagine it is not so predictable to the beloved comments box massive

*gets popcorn out*

This list has just lost its last shred of credibility.

Poor show all round for people whose taste in music is meant to be at professional levels.

Hang your head in shame, Guardian Music.

haha

just to post in character, did any metal make the list? A token album even? Mastodon?

The Lex is obviously truly invested in r'n'b and gets frustrated with critics fawning over this spruced up, watered down, crossover stuff when in his experience there's much better stuff out there

framing in the argument in this way cracks me up since there are a LOT of people who would characterize the kind of R&B that lex stumps for as spruced up, watered down, crossover stuff. that's kind of why i shy away from these "REAL R&B" convos because i'm used to being on the other end of those kinds of debates about soul music traditions and purism.

that said, R&B is having a serious identity crisis these days, critically as well as commercially and creatively, but i feel like that also makes it an exciting time with a lot of music that's great and/or worth talking about.

i dont read the guardian so i dont know what the 'comments box massive' listen to generally, but i can make a guess at radiohead,gapdyxx,fleet foxes, bon iver etc?

43 Machine Head – Unto the Locust

^ metal on the Guardian list

i didn't expect machine head to be the token metal act! I've not heard that album but it's popping up a lot. I suppose I should give it a listen. I did like a couple of their older albums

But... but... this is top of the pops fodder. This is uninteresting, unintelligent, plain boring pop music. There is really only one album issued this year that you think is better than this? Only one?

:D

pop music is boring?

Innerspeaker

15 December 2011 1:25PM
Response to rupert303, 15 December 2011 1:17PM

Hang your head in shame, Guardian Music.

Both Katy B and Beyonce are in the Hipster's Bible's (Pitchfork's) Top 30 albums of the year.

You know, just saying.....

Just sayin'

Yes nothing in the guardian list should appear in any other list.

lex do you know how many people voted?

No! Considering 2011 was one of the best years for music in years (much better than the last two anyway) this list is your worst ever...

Where on earth are Girls, Yuck and WU LYF?

where indeed!

HA HA.

(I say this not having heard the Katy B album. But I do know that Girls and Wu Lyf are shitty shit shit. Not heard Yuck either.)

lex do you know how many people voted?

not exactly sure how many, all the regular contributors i'd guess

the Katy B has been the perfect December record.

Pretty sure as part of Guardian Music's application process you have to submit a 500 word essay on how you would pleasure Thom Yorke.

Wait, remind me, why don't I write for the Grauniad agane>?

i've never heard wu lyf, but i do know that yuck and girls are among the worst music i've heard, like, ever

funnily enough I thought of you K when I read that

I mean jesus! Fucked Up release an absoutely jaw dropping call to arms concept album loaded with fight and fire and that doesnt get in the top 50 but you see fit to give this school disco faux-chav pop drivel NUMBER 2!

It fucking is a number 2 but not of the 'record of the year' kind.

whiney playing brit again?

See if Mastodon were to be #1. The comments box would explode with metal stereotyping wouldnt it?

Guardian missing the chance to troll there.

the Katy B has been the perfect December record.

i was going to say this about the andy stott or demdike stares discs, if and when it finally gets cold around here.

The Andy Stott is now out in a 2CD version with bonus tracks (which are of a similar level of quality to the rest)

i dont read the guardian so i dont know what the 'comments box massive' listen to generally, but i can make a guess at radiohead,gapdyxx,fleet foxes, bon iver etc?

― Minga Frump (Jimmy Riddle), Thursday, 15 December 2011 13:25 (41 minutes ago) Bookmark Permalink

the thing is that most ppl who comment there literally just do so to complain about stuff, so for the most part who the fuck even knows

to an extent that's because there's no real sense of community and personal interaction that you get on an actual messageboard, but I think another important factor is that they're the worst group of people on the face of the planet

I used to love pop music, and the pop music I used to love back then I still love now. But this is rubbish, and all of the other items on your list are rubbish. The rot set in about 1987 and we've had a terminal decline ever since that leaves us with just this drek to listen to. And you know it too: you can pretend all you like, but you feel the vacuum deep inside.

:D

Terrible, awful pop nonsense - and for the record I really do like good pop music. Ting Tings was a superb pop album. This is not.

^this is the best so far I think