J.R. Smith has literally been shanghaied away for the foreshortened 2011-2012 NBA season: rolling ILH sandbox thread

you know who was psyched abt that trade: houston

Still way better than losing in the first round of the playoffs and then having nothing for next season. I'm not sure what you expected them to get for him.

well just off the top of my head they couldve traded him for pau gasol

but like they have three months to trade him, this deal wouldve still been there, why because they were getting fleeced

the whole better than losing him in the off season argument is a total straw man

i don't feel like theyd be a serious contender w/ Gasol either
also I'm not sure they get a better deal if they sit on him for 3 months

Isn't their something about 6 months with a team for Bird rights in the new CBA? I remember it being discussed. If so, then he loses the chance at an extra 20 million dollars if he's traded after the New Year.

Which is why he might sue. They could cost him a ton of money.

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Billy Hunter tells Bloomberg that he anticipates Chris Paul will be in training camp. As for lawsuit: ``Not at this moment.'' #NBA
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Billy Hunter: ``we've got to is look at the circumstances and investigate it further.'' #NBA
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Billy Hunter tells Bloomberg he's waiting to hear from Chris Paul. Probably talk with NBA later today. #NBA
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David Stern talking to Bloomberg's @masonlev #NBA
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Stern: ``I don't want to speak on the basketball side, but that particular one was weighed against Chris Paul's continued presence in NO.''
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As for other trades, Stern says ``I'll leave that to the team as the discussion goes on.''
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`The decision was taken that Chris Paul in New Orleans was more valuable than the trade that was being discussed,David Stern tells Bloomberg
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maybe the league will force the hornets to trade paul into NBA pergatory, e.g., the raptors or cavs.

generally deals get better as the trade deadline approaches, obvs theres no guarantee, and theres literally nothing they could do this year that would make them a contender, what any team wants when they are forced to move a superstar and go into rebuilding mode is some combo of good young players, quality draft picks, and cap relief, they got none of those things!

then what trade deadline deals would you say compare to this? as great as CP3 is I can't imagine that his value is super high when he's only under contract for this year. also I think you underestimate some of the players they got back. I would definitely think that puts them in "one or two pieces away" territory

I guess the Knicks pick isn't going to be as good as I thought though since picks outside the top 15 or so generally aren't worth much

from last night, here are some of the players picked since 04 or so in the 17-21 range

eric bledsoe, ty lawson, javale mcgee, jj hickson, roy hibbert, nick young, sean williams, rajon rondo, danny granger, hakeem warrick, josh smith, j.r. smith, jameer nelson

so i mean you can get a really great player in that range of where the knicks pick is going to be. obv there are busts in there too, but it's not like you're confined to taking someone who's gonna be your seventh best player.

you're talking about the possibility of CP3 being traded to the NYK? if the league killed the CP3-to-lakers deal because of "competitive balance" issues raised by angry small-market team owners, the league isn't going to let CP3 go to the knicks either.

the league needs to get out of the business of owning a team, immediately.

if a buyer can't be found within this (reasonable) time period, maybe the team shouldn't exist.

I just think the whole "competitive balance" thing is really overstated. I don't even think the fans want it. Interest in the NBA is higher when these "superteams" do exist.

the fans aren't demanding it. small-market owners are (presumably believing that local interest in their teams will benefit from it).

check out what the wolves got for garnet

Boston sent the Minnesota Timberwolves forwards Al Jefferson, Ryan Gomes and Gerald Green, guard Sebastian Telfair and center Theo Ratliff, two first-round draft picks and cash considerations. Besides Ratliff, 34, the other four are 24 or younger.

the picks were bostons (meh) and minnesotas (quality! turned out to be the 6th pick, lol trading for a pick you already traded away)

so a young all star, a young role player, a young guy w/possible upside, some other young guy, a major expiring contract a quality draft pick & a shitty draft pick

at the time lots people were saying minny got robbed fwiw

right, so the question is, should David Stern be acting on the behalf of the owners or the fans? I dunno, the whole situation makes my head spin - this is exactly why league-owned teams should never happen

from last night, here are some of the players picked since 04 or so in the 17-21 range

eric bledsoe, ty lawson, javale mcgee, jj hickson, roy hibbert, nick young, sean williams, rajon rondo, danny granger, hakeem warrick, josh smith, j.r. smith, jameer nelson

so i mean you can get a really great player in that range of where the knicks pick is going to be. obv there are busts in there too, but it's not like you're confined to taking someone who's gonna be your seventh best player.

― v-shasty, Friday, December 9, 2011 11:54 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Permalink

omg u cherry picking bastard

right, so the question is, should David Stern be acting on the behalf of the owners or the fans? I dunno, the whole situation makes my head spin - this is exactly why league-owned teams should never happen

― I'm in the mood to party (J0n Arbuckle), Friday, December 9, 2011 11:59 AM (12 seconds ago) Bookmark Permalink

yeah exactly

hey jordan watch this the last pick of the 2nd round is actually p valuable, heres some players who were picked there: manu ginobili

you act like none of the guys the Hornets would get were valuable at all? true most of them aren't young (besides Dragic?) but all were nice trade chips in themselves.

behead david stern plz

the league needs to get out of the business of owning a team, immediately.

if a buyer can't be found within this (reasonable) time period, maybe the team shouldn't exist.

― Daniel, Esq., Friday, December 9, 2011 11:56 AM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Permalink

the thing thats happening according to some people is there are just no $300m type offers on the table, and the other owners dont want to sell for what they can get because itll set a price precedent and depress the value of all their teams, theyre basically waiting out the rescission hoping for the best, the dicks

you act like none of the guys the Hornets would get were valuable at all? true most of them aren't young (besides Dragic?) but all were nice trade chips in themselves.

― I'm in the mood to party (J0n Arbuckle), Friday, December 9, 2011 12:04 PM (18 seconds ago) Bookmark Permalink

there are some ok players but not close to enough talent, not enough youth

you're talking about the possibility of CP3 being traded to the NYK? if the league killed the CP3-to-lakers deal because of "competitive balance" issues raised by angry small-market team owners, the league isn't going to let CP3 go to the knicks either.

― Daniel, Esq., Friday, December 9, 2011 10:55 AM (9 minutes ago) Bookmark Permalink

the knicks pick we're talking about is just one first round draft picked owned by the hornets

omg u cherry picking bastard

― Cooper Chucklebutt, Friday, December 9, 2011 10:59 AM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Permalink

well duh i'm cherry picking, but my point is that plenty of good to great players have been drafted in that spot. you're acting like it's a middle of the second round pick.

honestly once you get outside the top 7 or 8 picks or so... players 9-20 are gonna be roughly equal, so a pick from the knicks that's 17 or 18 is just about as good as a low lottery pick imo

the knicks pick we're talking about is just one first round draft picked owned by the hornets

― v-shasty, Friday, December 9, 2011 11:06 AM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Permalink

and by hornets i mean rockets -- it would've been traded to the hornets by the rockets in this trade

the thing thats happening according to some people is there are just no $300m type offers on the table, and the other owners dont want to sell for what they can get because itll set a price precedent and depress the value of all their teams, theyre basically waiting out the rescission hoping for the best, the dicks

you can see the legitimate business-judgment in the owners' position, but there is an inevitable conflict between their role as league owners and their role as collective owners of a single team within that league. if the market was improving fast, and a suitable buyer was likely to emerge in the next few months, then it would be an unpleasent but tolerable situation. but that's not likely to be the case.

its abt the likelihood of getting a good player and what the likelihood that player will be really good is, and i agree that pick has some value, but for chris paul you should be getting a top 5 pick, and i fwiw totally reject yr hypothesis re spots 9-20 xp

BREAKING: Orlando makes a trade!

Brandon Bass for Big Baby.

hmmm

hmmmmmmmm -- i like that for the celtics -- they needed better rebounding/defense inside than what baby could provide imo

and the magic can play baby w/ howard and not worry about his D

yeah i think i agree

my understanding is if he gets picked up in the draft/wavier wire thing i dont know what to call mode then the team who picks him up pays some set amount of the contract while the original team pays the rest - if no one picks him up hes a free agent and his original team pays the entire contract

― Cooper Chucklebutt, Friday, December 9, 2011 11:14 AM (1 hour ago)

i'm still unclear on this - so if a dude gets amnestied and is not picked up by another team on waivers, he basically gets his whole contract bought out? so if billups doesn't get picked up he'll be getting paid anyway and can sign with the heat for the vet min?

rip b roy ;_;

That's the gist k3v. He gets all his money either way, just can't automatically dictate where he is going to play.

i'm still unclear on this - so if a dude gets amnestied and is not picked up by another team on waivers, he basically gets his whole contract bought out? so if billups doesn't get picked up he'll be getting paid anyway and can sign with the heat for the vet min?

― k3vin k., Friday, December 9, 2011 11:42 AM (10 seconds ago) Bookmark Permalink

no, i think it's that the player's contract stays the same -- he doesn't get more or less money -- if he doesn't get picked up, the old team just pays it out as if he was on the team -- if he does get picked up, there's some system that determines how much of the existing contract the new team pays

no i think i read somewhere that the og team buys him out but the salary doesn't count against their cap?

i don't think that if the player gets picked up that he loses any of his salary -- there's no way the union would've agreed to that

in other news, the nets are going to get investigated by the league for tampering. apparently dwight met up w/ prohk & billy king in miami w/o orlando's knowledge.

"is not legal?"

lol

i don't think that if the player gets picked up that he loses any of his salary -- there's no way the union would've agreed to that

― v-shasty, Friday, December 9, 2011 12:46 PM (15 seconds ago) Bookmark Permalink

yah he gets it all either way, only diff as far as i can tell is if he signs a new contract as a free agent he gets that money too

dear david stern plz send dwight howard to boston and also chris paul if u feel like it thank you

player is bought out for the amount due him; his salary does not count against the cap.

player is guaranteed to get all the money remaining on his contract.

teams under the cap may bid on his services - x amount per year remaining. x amount is subtracted from the amount owed to him from original team and paid by claimant.

if he clears waivers, he may sign with whomever for whatever. I believe this is also subtracted from amount original team owes. I don't believe he can end up making more than before.

no i'm saying that a team can cut a bad contract to make room for someone else, but they still have to pay him his contract. but that money is basically under the table and the contract does not count on their payroll

so say billups is not picked up on waivers by another team - the knicks buy him out of his contract - he gets his money - and now since he's paid anyway he can just go to a contending team to play for a low price

but idk that wouldnt make sense b/c he could just re-sign with the knicks lol