CHICAGO: If Hepatitis C Were Attacking Your Face Instead of Your Liver You'd Be Doing Something About It

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Said playwriting prof: http://www.wmich.edu/theater/faculty/images/faculty_14.jpg

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 22:41 (seventeen years ago) link

I hear you Eric. xp

― Handgun O. Mendocino (pullapartgirl), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 22:41 (seventeen years ago) link

I wrote a short play a few years ago about a late-night college-radio DJ, and the whole point of it is that she's trying to cover up her emotions in order to do her job. And so she's trying to be banal (unemotional), and it doesn't work out. But by the end, when she reads the weather or says 'um', those should be the most compelling parts - not when she speaks all poetically, which is just her trying and failing to do her job.

― Eazy (Eazy), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 22:43 (seventeen years ago) link

Yeah, I love that play.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 22:43 (seventeen years ago) link

Although, to John, I think that Altman (I don't know about the other person you mentioned) does more what Eric said - he allows for banal-seeming dialog that actually leads to profound things. It's not just purposeless banality.

Aren't there some web comics (or print, I dunno) that put principles more like what John is talking about into practice? I might be thinking of the Itchy and Scratchy lemonade cartoon that someone quoted on the banal conversation thread, but I can totally see a four panel comic in which two characters have a totally pointless and boring conversation.

― Handgun O. Mendocino (pullapartgirl), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 22:45 (seventeen years ago) link

Near-topic: The Brown Bunny (at least up till the end) was supposed to be an exploration of the tedium of driving cross-country--though cut with weird, silent making out--but it refused to do its part in the exploration. It was lazy "art" that is supposedly engaging the viewers by making them use their imaginations, but it's really just slack slapping together of bits of video. (I actually found some of the road shots really interesting on their own, but in context, really boring.)

― crunkleJ (crunkleJ), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 22:48 (seventeen years ago) link

Jenny: I don't think I actually want to have the completely pointless banal conversation. I think I just love the banal elements, the verite style, so much that I let that overwhelm my sense about what's actually great about what I'm seeing. I don't know how to properly integrate them (not that I've actually tried writing a play in YEARS -- which makes me sad). For instance, I love in EZ's play how she says "famous whatever" -- I love how she doesn't finish, how she can't be articulate, how she stumbles over the words, just like anyone would -- but at the same time, the real powerful dramatic moment of the play, if you've ever seen it performed or on film, is how the "I'm so fucking sad" comes out unannounced, and it pierces.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 22:49 (seventeen years ago) link

I actually found some of the road shots really interesting on their own, but in context, really boring.

I don't understand this. I found some of the road shots really interesting, too: the Gordon Lightfoot song soundtracking rain on a windshield is particularly beautiful -- but I don't see how the "context" takes away from the beauty. What is the context, anyway?

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 22:52 (seventeen years ago) link

The David Lynch cartoon about the meanest dog in the world definitely does that. He just sits in the yard on his chain and growls, and then the sun goes down and that's it.

The Brown Bunny is an interesting example of seeing a guy do very little for a long, long time, but then at the end you understand the circumstances. If it didn't have the payoff, it would be more like a travelogue than anything else. Which, if the scenery was pretty...

x-post - Jesse beat me to it!

― Eazy (Eazy), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 22:52 (seventeen years ago) link

I like Eric's premise for a movie, the guy standing in the high rise talking on the phone for 90 minutes. It would be a like a modern day more solitary version of rear window. There would be no interacting with any one in person. I wouldn't want to hear the other side of the conversation. I would make a majority of the film POV, peering into other people's office windows, looking at the activity on the street. It would all work with his conversation on the phone, sometimes relevant, sometimes not. The film would be stylized to an extent, by having the camera have better vision than the man actually has. The detail that he sees out the window would be important.

― Jeff... (Jeff...), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:00 (seventeen years ago) link

I really like the POV idea. Maybe we wouldn't even see the man, just hear his voice -- which might make it seem more intimate.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:01 (seventeen years ago) link

Hence my earlier question about whether we would see what was going on outside the window, sort of.

― danno martinez (danno martinez), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:02 (seventeen years ago) link

You're right - you don't even need to see the guy's face, really. Just an establishing shot in the office, something against the glass, and then whatever he sees out the window during the conversation. And with all the HD stuff now (used in the night shots in Collateral), the details could be really beautiful.

― Eazy (Eazy), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:08 (seventeen years ago) link

Then you could overdub all the audio without even having to worry about matching dialogue to mouth movements.

― JordanC (JordanC), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:10 (seventeen years ago) link

The context of... endless road shots followed by a so-so payoff with the gratuitous BJ and twist ending. The road shots were not intersting enough to take up as much time as they did and it did not need to be a feature-length movie. I can't imagine how tedious it would have been in the uncut Cannes version that Roger Ebert talked shit about.

― crunkleJ (crunkleJ), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:12 (seventeen years ago) link

Elephant, Last Days, and United 93 were all interestingly antidramatic movies - those three all have really compellingly banal situations and dialogue. Seeing someone eat a meal or talk about 'whatever' underscores the lack of fate or destiny in any of those situations.

― Eazy (Eazy), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:17 (seventeen years ago) link

Yeah, The Brown Bunny didn't really add up for me, but I can't deny that I enjoyed watching it -- much more so than Gerry, at least.

And yes, good call on all of those, Eric. I'd also add Bully, which demonstrated the banality of evil more provocatively than anything else I can think of.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:21 (seventeen years ago) link

I mean, those three films have really artful banality - the scenes have no great subtext or tension to them, and the effect is stronger (to me, anyway) than if there were dramatic storylines (star-crossed lovers and all) that reached a confluence when the big dramatic event happens. Instead, the stakes are low, which is more believable and powerful.

― Eazy (Eazy), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:21 (seventeen years ago) link

Not to continue this conversation forever, but it'd be interested to get Amanda's fella's take on this -- because, in making a documentary, you really can just capture ordinary moments, if you want, without creating a dramatic arc or storyline. Frederick Weisman's movies are incredibly banal but also edited in a way that they really give you a sense of their subject matter. Sh3rrif is kind of halfway between Weisman and Cops as far as banality-vs.-action.

― Eazy (Eazy), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:24 (seventeen years ago) link

I think United 93 is also powerful in part because of the dramatic disconnect between the viewer's knowledge of "OMG 9/11 WTF" and the film's subjects working like it was any other day, cracking jokes, making coffee, etc.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:25 (seventeen years ago) link

Not to continue this conversation forever

I want to continue this over drinks. Because I want to make this movie.

― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:26 (seventeen years ago) link

dudes, do it!

― horseshoe (horseshoe), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:27 (seventeen years ago) link

I'm heading out in a few mins too, but let's.

You're right, J. - all three of those are OMG 9/11, OMG COLUMBUINE, OMG ROCK-STAR SUICIDE, ho-de-hum, breakfast, etc. With no other competing dramatic storylines (kid dying of cancer, couple fighting, whatever), which I love.

― Eazy (Eazy), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:30 (seventeen years ago) link

OTM. If Brown Bunny's outcome had been clear at the beginning then the rest of the movie would actually have been really great. It might have had to have been a little more dramatic than a overdose (right?) but still, it would have helped. But the banality continued right through to the end, even to the point that Sevigny is smoking pot (as opposed to harder drugs or doing something more interesting) and Gallo is whining, "Why do you drink and do drugs?"

― crunkleJ (crunkleJ), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:50 (seventeen years ago) link

Never a sense of something looming.

So little depends
upon the Brown Bunny
driving across the country.

― crunkleJ (crunkleJ), Tuesday, 2 January 2007 23:54 (seventeen years ago) link

john & jon, sorry, didn't see your txt until about 2:30 on friday night. i was with some people who were thinking about going up there but we couldn't come up with a compelling enough reason.

my loss i'm sure.

― otto midnight, that 'tofu makes you gay' ding dong (otto midnight), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 00:01 (seventeen years ago) link

Although it strikes me that the something-looming contexts in the three movies EZ names are somewhat dependent on a knowledge going in: I mean, I think it's hard to avoid with United 93 -- there's probably even a "September 11, 2001" title at the beginning -- but with the Van Sant films, isn't the something-looming precisely because we already know (from reading reviews or whatever) that we're watching his Columbine movie or his Kurt Cobain movie? Is any of that spelled out within the film itself?

xpost: Otto, it's cool -- I only ended up staying there for about 15 minutes, just long enough to meet Jon. I did run into an ex-co-worker of mine, though.

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 00:05 (seventeen years ago) link

I finally put a note on my water bottle that says POR FAVOR, ¡NO LO BOTES!

If they throw this one out, I'm going on a rampage. I don't have $1.69 to spend on Nantucket Nectars every other day.

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 00:20 (seventeen years ago) link

Get one:

http://www.nalgene-outdoor.com/store/images/2078-2015-12L.jpg

― Handgun O. Mendocino (pullapartgirl), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 00:47 (seventeen years ago) link

No.

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 02:01 (seventeen years ago) link

Or you could write "No es basura", John. That's what my Chicano colleague said to put on my cup when it was getting thrown out.

― Laurel (Laurel), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 02:03 (seventeen years ago) link

Get one:

2x, just don't get the narrow mouth kind like the one in the picture because you can't fit 1. ice cubes through it and 2. a water purifier on it.

― danno martinez (danno martinez), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 02:34 (seventeen years ago) link

Favor de no tirar. Botar means something more like to throw or toss whiletirar means to throw away.

― crunkleJ (crunkleJ), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 03:15 (seventeen years ago) link

"Please do not throw this bottle."

― crunkleJ (crunkleJ), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 03:15 (seventeen years ago) link

"Fragile: glass may break if thrown."

― Laurel (Laurel), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 03:17 (seventeen years ago) link

Actually, botar is OK too, according to the most useful website ever, wordreference.com. The best might be Favor de no echar en la basura or Esta botella no es basura, y si no quiere que el ICE le deporte, no lo tires en la basura, pinche mojado flojo.

― crunkleJ (crunkleJ), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 03:21 (seventeen years ago) link

And the cleaners should leave a note saying, "Comprete un Nalgene, puto Americano."

― crunkleJ (crunkleJ), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 03:24 (seventeen years ago) link

Kr told me to use "botar." I think she consulted with her Ecuadoran co-workers.

― jaymc (jaymc), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 03:37 (seventeen years ago) link

Don't tell her to ask them what I said means.

― crunkleJ (crunkleJ), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 06:11 (seventeen years ago) link

I like the small mouth bottles better because I am less likely to pour water down my chin when drinking. I don't use much ice and never leave Chicago so filtered water isn't an issue, either.

I am now down to one bottle and no caps, though, so I need to pick up a couple more to get my three bottle rotation in place for next semester.

― Handgun O. Mendocino (pullapartgirl), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 14:45 (seventeen years ago) link

Sunovabitch I have to work a full day today because my coworker is sick. BOOOOOOOO. Who wants to meet me for lunch?

― Handgun O. Mendocino (pullapartgirl), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 14:48 (seventeen years ago) link

i would but i'm at least 5 miles from chicago city limits and about 15 from the loop so i doubt i could make it.

― otto midnight, that 'tofu makes you gay' ding dong (otto midnight), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 14:49 (seventeen years ago) link

I finally put my Ikea bookshelf together last night.

― JordanC (JordanC), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 15:02 (seventeen years ago) link

Ok, 3van put it together and I helped.

― JordanC (JordanC), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 15:02 (seventeen years ago) link

Also a problem w/ the small-mouthed bottles: can't get a spoon in them when you make chocolate pudding by wedging the bottle between rocks in cold running water. : D

― Laurel (Laurel), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 15:04 (seventeen years ago) link

wow, that's like the pudding equivelant of free basing cocaine laurel.

― otto midnight, that 'tofu makes you gay' ding dong (otto midnight), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 15:20 (seventeen years ago) link

you may have a pudding abuse problem.

― otto midnight, that 'tofu makes you gay' ding dong (otto midnight), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 15:20 (seventeen years ago) link

You try eating freeze-dried, boiled things for three days and see what you'll do for pudding.

― Laurel (Laurel), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 15:28 (seventeen years ago) link

I don't understand the MacGyver pudding.

I want to see Children of Men but apparently it's not playing here. :(

xpost

― JordanC (JordanC), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 15:29 (seventeen years ago) link

You try eating freeze-dried, boiled things for three days and see what you'll do for pudding.

i'm not talking about what i've done for pudding on the internet.

― otto midnight, that 'tofu makes you gay' ding dong (otto midnight), Wednesday, 3 January 2007 15:30 (seventeen years ago) link

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