was there tongue?
― sarahel, Thursday, 8 December 2011 04:14 (twelve years ago) link
like was it _frenching_ ?
i guess the gray area for you is the amount of tongue action!
i don't know. i wasn't there. it happened in NYC (i live in DC) at a party i was conspicuously not invited to attend
― Z S, Thursday, 8 December 2011 04:25 (twelve years ago) link
was it as probing as a sarahel volley of questions?
― estela, Thursday, 8 December 2011 04:33 (twelve years ago) link
lol,yeah. it was a kiss,the amount of tongue is irrelevant.
― jim in glasgow, Thursday, 8 December 2011 04:35 (twelve years ago) link
lol - i forget where the "frenching" joke came from - i just remember it being hilarious on some other thread.
― sarahel, Thursday, 8 December 2011 04:46 (twelve years ago) link
:)
― estela, Thursday, 8 December 2011 04:49 (twelve years ago) link
but yeah, i'm sure to others the fact that she kissed someone wouldn't be a big deal.
When my most recent ex and I had a falling out that led to our breakup this is exactly what he did as well - made out with some chick who he'd been hanging out with/talking to a lot more than I'd been comfy with (and I am NOT a jealous person). I'm not gonna lie - I was fucking PISSED and upset but I didnt dump him for it, I tried to get him not to let it lead him further away from me :(
... didnt work.
― Leave town with an orange, and pretend you're laughing at it. (Trayce), Thursday, 8 December 2011 05:20 (twelve years ago) link
I have to admit I don't get the "kissing is cheating" thing. Really, my gf could smooch whoever she wants and it wouldn't bother me at all. If anything, it offers a chance to show I'm not jealous or insecure abour our relationship.
― Everything else is secondary, Thursday, 8 December 2011 06:31 (twelve years ago) link
I've never got the jealousy thing, myself, but I've never been cheated on so my perspective is a little warped.
― Christine 'Green Leafy Dragon' Indigo, Thursday, 8 December 2011 06:42 (twelve years ago) link
yeah Z i can completely understand your being hurt and feeling badly used and feeling that you can't be with somebody who does that to you. last night i was just pondering that zone in me that isn't there, and it's been a source of contention with people who i've been involved with in the past, feeling slighted that i wasn't jealous enough or something
― Maybe Bartering Will Help (Julie Lagger), Thursday, 8 December 2011 08:44 (twelve years ago) link
I may well be the least jealous person walking the planet. If I'm away for the weekend and my gf told me she wants to chill with another guy for the night, even a guy I know she's been crushing out on, I'd tell her "go ahead, and have a great time!". And I'd mean it. It can feel scary at first, but there's something very powerful about sending out such an unambiguous signal that I'm so completely secure in the strength of our relationship that I'm not even slightly afraid she'll leave me for someone else.
― Everything else is secondary, Thursday, 8 December 2011 08:48 (twelve years ago) link
lj has two logins?
― bloating forecast: ruff swells (p much resigned to deems), Thursday, 8 December 2011 08:50 (twelve years ago) link
i've had the whole "you're not jealous enough" thing, not expressly said but it was there, however i wouldn't want a gf kissing someone else, not at all! it's not about not being jealous, it's just...why?
― HI IT'S RONAN, Thursday, 8 December 2011 08:52 (twelve years ago) link
I'm not lj, just an incredible simulation
― Everything else is secondary, Thursday, 8 December 2011 08:57 (twelve years ago) link
"He's not lj, he's a very naughty boy!"
― Bela Lugosi's Derrida (MarkG oo la showaddywaddy), Thursday, 8 December 2011 09:42 (twelve years ago) link
also, and here's where a bunch of you will probably vehemently disagree with me....
...this definitely constituted "cheating".
You don't need to justify this - "the bunch of you" don't get to define what constitutes cheating in your relationship anymore than a bunch of people with no coats on get to define whether I'm feeling cold or not
― april wowak, Thursday, 8 December 2011 11:52 (twelve years ago) link
i'm glad someone picked him up on that, absolutely otm
― bloating forecast: ruff swells (p much resigned to deems), Thursday, 8 December 2011 11:57 (twelve years ago) link
april otm
― The Love Song of L. Alfred Sotosyn (dayo), Thursday, 8 December 2011 12:00 (twelve years ago) link
> "the bunch of you" don't get to define what constitutes cheating in your relationship anymore than a bunch of people with no coats on get to define whether I'm feeling cold or not
My last few posts notwithstanding, I agree with this too. One of the great things about being a couple is that you make your own rules as to what is or isn't acceptable to the two of you. I'm well aware I fall near the extreme end of the leniency spectrum here.
― Everything else is secondary, Thursday, 8 December 2011 13:05 (twelve years ago) link
loli love that dion quote, when asked about his marriage or something he loved about his wife: "she has an incredibly high tolerance for unacceptable behaviour"
― Never translate German (schlump), Thursday, 8 December 2011 13:06 (twelve years ago) link
celine's husband?
― bloating forecast: ruff swells (p much resigned to deems), Thursday, 8 December 2011 13:10 (twelve years ago) link
No, although he must have an incredibly high tolerance for unacceptable singing....
― Everything else is secondary, Thursday, 8 December 2011 13:31 (twelve years ago) link
celine dion's husband, dion
― Never translate German (schlump), Thursday, 8 December 2011 13:34 (twelve years ago) link
dion dion?
― Jilted John and Marsha (MarkG oo la showaddywaddy), Thursday, 8 December 2011 13:41 (twelve years ago) link
who can forget the chorus of dion's first million selling single
dion dion?Jilted John and Marsha!MarkG~oo lashowaddywaddy
― Never translate German (schlump), Thursday, 8 December 2011 13:51 (twelve years ago) link
i've noticed a trend among my aging friends who have been in relationships for awhile toward "opening up" relationships or exploring other kinds of arrangements and i wonder if this works. like if the concept of cheating becomes acceptable when it's demystified and in the open. i've never actually been in a relationship like this so i have no idea how it would work for me, but i have been able to, say, date someone casually who was also dating other people casually and not be bothered or jealous as long as they were upfront about it. it's always been the deception that irked me most, and not the sex itself.
― bene_gesserit, Thursday, 8 December 2011 16:06 (twelve years ago) link
and i've also seen friends with those types of arrangements have their relationships torn apart when their is an infidelity outside of the rules that have been set up, which suggests the same thing.
i wonder if good relationships are just as simple as having perfect open communication.
― bene_gesserit, Thursday, 8 December 2011 16:17 (twelve years ago) link
Because communication is so simple and easy ;-)
― Mr. Farmer, Thursday, 8 December 2011 16:23 (twelve years ago) link
"as simple as"
― c sharp major, Thursday, 8 December 2011 16:23 (twelve years ago) link
dammit xpost!
lol
why can't it be easy though? or at least, shouldn't people really be looking for someone they can communicate with easily? obviously it's not easy with everyone.
― bene_gesserit, Thursday, 8 December 2011 16:31 (twelve years ago) link
They probably should.
― Mr. Farmer, Thursday, 8 December 2011 16:39 (twelve years ago) link
i feel like it is v difficult to communicate honestly even with yourself, though!
it's pretty easy to tell yourself you're not doing something wrong when you actually are, and would recognise it if you wanted to see it.
― c sharp major, Thursday, 8 December 2011 16:43 (twelve years ago) link
What people think they want, and what they actually want are often quite different - and its sometimes only an event or occurrence that exposes the discrepancy between the two
― april wowak, Thursday, 8 December 2011 16:54 (twelve years ago) link
i have a lot of friends who have started open relationships and ended with separating. i know that it is not a universal, but in my observed experience "open relationships" are always a code for one person wanting permission from the other to do cheating, and the other person agreeing to a theoretical possibility
― remy bean in exile, Thursday, 8 December 2011 16:59 (twelve years ago) link
Girl I used to see has been finding a lot of reasons to hang out, gotten really involved with me at the occupation here, been going out and having drinks and winding up embracing half asleep on her couch a few times.
A few months back she mentioned she was "kind of seeing somebody," but after that initial mention I never heard of the guy again. Suddenly Sunday (at this) the guy shows up with her. He shows up a lot at camp over the last couple of days. He's as handsy on her as...well, as handsy as I've been the last few weeks. The kinds of things that she and I had been doing as a pair have now been happening, all this week, as a trio.
This is this the "ok i totally forgot i'm kinda dating this guy, can we just be friends" moment, isn't it?
― HOOS aka driver of steen, Thursday, 8 December 2011 17:23 (twelve years ago) link
oh the "this" was www.wired.com/threatlevel/2011/12/occupy-dc-barn/
― HOOS aka driver of steen, Thursday, 8 December 2011 17:24 (twelve years ago) link
see imo that's not nice behaviour
― bloating forecast: ruff swells (p much resigned to deems), Thursday, 8 December 2011 17:33 (twelve years ago) link
wanted to say that NV's post yesterday about love as a moment outside social-economic structures was beautiful, & that he might have a look at Bertrand Russell's searching 1929 monograph Marriage and Morals, wherein similar thoughts are pursued.
― by (mennen), Thursday, 8 December 2011 17:39 (twelve years ago) link
thank you :)
and any excuse to read Russell is a good one
― Maybe Bartering Will Help (Julie Lagger), Thursday, 8 December 2011 17:40 (twelve years ago) link
so wait does anyone want any dating advice?
― Homosexual II, Thursday, 8 December 2011 19:06 (twelve years ago) link
― ᶘ ᵒᴥᵒᶅ (~curious orange~), Thursday, 8 December 2011 19:07 (twelve years ago) link
BIG PICTURE
― Maybe Bartering Will Help (Julie Lagger), Thursday, 8 December 2011 19:23 (twelve years ago) link
> i've noticed a trend among my aging friends who have been in relationships for awhile toward "opening up" relationships or exploring other kinds of arrangements and i wonder if this works. like if the concept of cheating becomes acceptable when it's demystified and in the open. i've never actually been in a relationship like this so i have no idea how it would work for me.....
― bene_gesserit, Thursday, December 8, 2011 11:06 AM
> in my observed experience "open relationships" are always a code for one person wanting permission from the other to do cheating, and the other person agreeing to a theoretical possibility
― remy bean in exile, Thursday, December 8, 2011 11:59 AM
That's what people who have never been in an open relationship think an open relationship is. Many who want into this arrangement want to hold onto their significant other while still being able to see other people (and it's not "cheating" when it's mutually agreed upon rather than clandestine). But in actuality, I get more out of allowing my partner that freedom than having it for myself, for the reasons I stated earlier - allowing your mate to see others is the ultimate conveyance of trust and confidence. Not allowing her out of my sight to me feels like i'm treating my gf like a dog that has to be kept on a leash, lest she run away. I'd rather do the opposite, take off the leash and let her know in no uncertain terms that I trust her not to run away for good.
I've told every woman I've ever dated that if she ever found someone she liked better than me, to go ahead and follow her heart. Leaving *would* hurt me, but true, deep love to me meant putting her dreams ahead of my wishes. If that was the guy that did it for her, by all means I wanted her to take up with him, not pretend she liked me better and be resentful for the rest of her life whilst forever dreaming of what may have been. I can't stand the thought she wants to be with another but can't because of me, that I'm keeping her from being with the man she is pining for. What I've learned is that this strenghens the bond between us rather than threatening it, as it builds an incredible sense of trust between us that no vow of monogamy, much less marriage, ever could do. I don't want to stay together because we have to, I want the only thing keeping us together is that we want to be and that we've built something together that is expodentially greater than what either of us could be alone, and that we couldn't recreate that with anyone else but each other. Really, it works.
And if this seems like something you would never try yourself, consider what I've unexpectedly discovered: - when you give someone else this breadth of freedom in a relationship, they almost never take advantage of it.
― Everything else is secondary, Thursday, 8 December 2011 19:45 (twelve years ago) link
nah
― bloating forecast: ruff swells (p much resigned to deems), Thursday, 8 December 2011 20:17 (twelve years ago) link
I think they can work, it just takes a lot of trust and communication and people in general aren't very good at the latter one, so most of the time monogamy is just simpler.
― Homosexual II, Thursday, 8 December 2011 20:20 (twelve years ago) link
Also most people into polyamory are kinda ugly.
Why I that??! I've always wondered.
― ᶘ ᵒᴥᵒᶅ (~curious orange~), Thursday, 8 December 2011 20:21 (twelve years ago) link