I AM SPEECHLESS WITH RAGE (2012 Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Inductees)

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http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/07/showbiz/rock-hall-fame/index.html?hpt=hp_c3

OH NOES, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:40 (nine years ago) link

(ps: not really)

OH NOES, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:41 (nine years ago) link

lol

I left my login in El Sandboxo, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:41 (nine years ago) link

oh this should be 2012, oops

OH NOES, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:42 (nine years ago) link

Does it really matter?

I left my login in El Sandboxo, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:46 (nine years ago) link

Why is Paul Shaffer on the nominating committee?

http://www.futurerocklegends.com/Nominating_Committee.php

o. nate, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:47 (nine years ago) link

I wish the rock n roll hall of fame operated like sports hofs and used statistics w/r/t album sales and end of year lists so we could have sabremetric arguments like "did the small faces really have a HOF career?"

iatee, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:47 (nine years ago) link

Does it really matter?

nothing really matters now that The Cure have been bumped by RHCP

the ironic thing is that I wouldn't have had this reaction if RHCP had broken up after Blood Sugar Sex Magik

OH NOES, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:49 (nine years ago) link

I was really (not at all) looking forward to seeing what young band they'd pick to honor Fat Bob and the boys.

I left my login in El Sandboxo, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:52 (nine years ago) link

Why is Freddie King an "early influence"? His first record came out in 1960.

Tarfumes the Escape Goat, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:52 (nine years ago) link

kind of feels weird that RHCP and Beasties get in the headline but not GNR

sandbox banned socks (Mr. Stevenson #2), Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:54 (nine years ago) link

i think Blink 182 are still the biggest Cure fans on the pop charts so it'll probably hilariously be them someday

sandbox banned socks (Mr. Stevenson #2), Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:55 (nine years ago) link

kind of feels weird that RHCP and Beasties get in the headline but not GNR

in fairness, both RHCP and the Beasties still exist as commercially viable bands

OH NOES, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:55 (nine years ago) link

yeah but the hilarious media circus around GNR has never really ended. if anything it will just get more fun with this latest development.

sandbox banned socks (Mr. Stevenson #2), Wednesday, 7 December 2011 15:57 (nine years ago) link

i think Blink 182 are still the biggest Cure fans on the pop charts so it'll probably hilariously be them someday

Based on this year's voting, my fear is that Blink will get in before the Cure.

I left my login in El Sandboxo, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 16:01 (nine years ago) link

the only way I can forgive this crew of cowards from not voting for Donna Summer is if they ask her to sing "Enough is Enough" with the Chili Peppers backing her.

Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 16:03 (nine years ago) link

Adding to rage: Eric B & Rakim were passed over.

Tarfumes the Escape Goat, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 16:04 (nine years ago) link

seriously though, One Hot Minute should be enough to keep anyone out of any type of Hall of Fame, even if you DID also record Freaky Styly

OH NOES, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 16:06 (nine years ago) link

I read somewhere that Jann Wenner successfully lobbied for a modification of the bylaws so that Kings of Leon can get in on the first ballot.

Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 16:09 (nine years ago) link

"Disco sucks" lives, still. Unbelievable. Especially considering the rhythmic undertow of the Chili Peppers' recent radio hits. Who says Neil Diamond and Billy Joel are Rock and Roll but Donna and Chic aren't?

thewufs, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 16:54 (nine years ago) link

Still no Rush :(

Todd

realness, just realness, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 17:57 (nine years ago) link

Why is Freddie King an "early influence"? His first record came out in 1960.

I guess b/c he's a bluesman? So he's not himself considered "ROCK AND ROLL," but Keith Richards owned his records.

jaymc, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:01 (nine years ago) link

xpost

It seems like Rush is never going to make the list, so the Hall of Fame is essentially meaningless.

moodles, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:02 (nine years ago) link

is Rush THE most canonical '70s AOR classic rock band that hasn't been inducted? there's gotta be others, right?

sockness, just sockness (Mr. Stevenson #2), Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:03 (nine years ago) link

Black artists only get to be "influences", not actual hall of famers themselves. I mean, ffs, this white-washing of rock history by RS is hardly surprising at this point, but the more I think about Chic and Eric B and Rakim getting snubbed the more annoyed I get. Of course the safe white rappers from the 80s would get inducted first.

Black Sabbath - xpost

I left my login in El Sandboxo, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:03 (nine years ago) link

I guess b/c he's a bluesman? So he's not himself considered "ROCK AND ROLL," but Keith Richards Eric Clapton owned his records.

Fixed. Freddie basically invented EC, and the hall luvs them some EC.

Tumblr Whites Off Earth Now!! (Sandbox Grisso-McCain), Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:06 (nine years ago) link

xxpost

Kiss is another glaring ommission.

moodles, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:06 (nine years ago) link

NAGL for the HOF when 5/7 white artists were inducted, compared with 1/5 multiracial or black artists.

jaymc, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:08 (nine years ago) link

(I am counting GNR as multiracial b/c of Slash.)

jaymc, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:08 (nine years ago) link

(Oh, and Kirk Hammett, too.)

jaymc, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:09 (nine years ago) link

Black Sabbath - xpost

They were inducted in 2006.

jaymc, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:10 (nine years ago) link

super awesome that the Small Faces/Faces are making it

upper mississippi 2: still shakin, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:11 (nine years ago) link

Yeah, I'm not sure what I was thinking. I remember them being a notable omission for awhile though.

(xpost)

I left my login in El Sandboxo, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:12 (nine years ago) link

I love that they waited til after Kirshner died to honor him.

Tumblr Whites Off Earth Now!! (Sandbox Grisso-McCain), Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:13 (nine years ago) link

Kiss is another glaring ommission.

"Kiss is not a great band, Kiss was never a great band, Kiss never will be a great band, and I have done my share to keep them off the ballot." -- Dave Marsh

Tarfumes the Escape Goat, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:15 (nine years ago) link

dave marsh otm

sockness, just sockness (Mr. Stevenson #2), Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:16 (nine years ago) link

"the red hot chili peppers, on the other hand..."

n/a, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:17 (nine years ago) link

pointing out that the HOF (or 'rock' itself as a cultural institution) privileges white people seems almost too obvious to talk about but in a year where two of the big inductees are the Beastie Boys and the Red Hot Chili Peppers it probably is a good time to force the issue (xpost

sockness, just sockness (Mr. Stevenson #2), Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:18 (nine years ago) link

Yeah, but see, I think Kiss is actually like the perfect band for that circus anyway. Seriously though, they were hugely influential and even though I think their music was mediocre at best, I can get behind them deserving to be in there for their cultural legacy.

I left my login in El Sandboxo, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:18 (nine years ago) link

is Rush THE most canonical '70s AOR classic rock band that hasn't been inducted? there's gotta be others, right?

Kiss
Cheap Trick
Deep Purple
Steve Miller Band
Guess Who
REO Speedwagon
Badfinger
Bad Company
Foreigner
Journey

(Last two arguably better described as '80s bands.)

jaymc, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:19 (nine years ago) link

Exactly, those two bands getting in are why it makes it harder for me to swallow the Eric B & Rakim and Chic snubs.

(xpost)

I left my login in El Sandboxo, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:19 (nine years ago) link

I feel like Chic will eventually get Ron Santo'd in. Hopefully Nile Rodgers doesn't have to die first.

jaymc, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:22 (nine years ago) link

But maybe Jann Wenner does.

jaymc, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:24 (nine years ago) link

Rush seems more objectively likely and/or 'deserving' of induction than pretty much everyone on jaymc's (very helpful!) list, except maaaaybe Steve Miller and Deep Purple?

sockness, just sockness (Mr. Stevenson #2), Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:24 (nine years ago) link

You'd think that even the HOF can justify its aversion to disco and black artists by including Chic; Nile Rodgers has produced half of the artists in the room or nominated.

Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:26 (nine years ago) link

guys the HOF is a joke!

flexidisc, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:26 (nine years ago) link

"the red hot chili peppers, on the other hand..."

Exactly. Then again, either Dave doesn't have veto power, or he was way outvoted. I can't imagine for the life of me that he would argue RHCP (whom he hasn't expressed much of an interest in) should get in over Chic (whom he loves).

Also, if Dave had that much sway, the MC5 would've gotten in years ago.

Tarfumes the Escape Goat, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:26 (nine years ago) link

woah i didn't know Deep Purple wasn't in! crazy!

been listening to Made in Japan lately goddamn those dudes brought it live.

upper mississippi 2: still shakin, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:27 (nine years ago) link

Rush seems more objectively likely and/or 'deserving' of induction than pretty much everyone on jaymc's (very helpful!) list, except maaaaybe Steve Miller and Deep Purple?

Problem is, Miles Davis' ghost is on the nominating committee. And no way is Miles gonna let that sorry-ass non-playing motherfucker Steve Miller in.

Tarfumes the Escape Goat, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:28 (nine years ago) link

Isn't Steve Miller Band's Greatest Hits still the biggest selling catalogue release of all time? I know it was at some point several years ago. Throw 'em a bone, I guess.

I'm still in a fiery rage about Donna Summer being excluded AGAIN.

Johnny Fever, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 18:29 (nine years ago) link

"...he was inconsolable that Donna Summer was snubbed again," he continued.

I left my login in El Sandboxo, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 21:20 (nine years ago) link

lol

Johnny Fever, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 21:21 (nine years ago) link

i wonder if anything has ever happened in the history of Red Hot Chili Peppers that has not provoked the members of the band to cry, take off their shirts and hug each other

sockness, just sockness (Mr. Stevenson #2), Wednesday, 7 December 2011 21:23 (nine years ago) link

what a great interview.

One of the cool things about it is that all of the past inductees vote. So, I don't know, Paul McCartney had the chance to vote for you.

I have an absolute smile on my face while you say that.

tylerw_sandbox, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 21:24 (nine years ago) link

"You didn't let me finish. Paul McCartney had the chance to vote for you, and wrote 'Decent band, shite singer' next to RHCP on the ballot."

Tarfumes the Escape Goat, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 21:41 (nine years ago) link

Haven't been a Rush fan since high school, but I was in a venerable Toronto steakhouse last week and Geddy Lee (a regular, the waiter said) walked in with his family.

clemenza, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 21:54 (nine years ago) link

i assume all diners fell to their knees in reverence. as your Canadian constitution commands you.

tylerw_sandbox, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 21:57 (nine years ago) link

Always thought they'd be vegetarians for some reason, but I guess Ayn Rand's more of a meat-eating icon.

clemenza, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 22:02 (nine years ago) link

this is only tangentially related, but just saw this via Richard Thompson's site:

Rolling Stone slips to number 69 in Thompson poll
11/27/2011 (updated 11/28/2011)
Rolling Stone, the popular music and related arts and culture magazine, dropped 50 places in Richard Thompson's annual assessment of periodical publications. When asked to comment on the sudden decrease in popularity, Thompson said, "It was a close-run thing for number 68, but I thought Cheese Gourmet Monthly just edged it for their terrific piece on Blue Wensleydale in the August issue. I placed RS above Woman's Realm, which has had some fairly insipid knitting patterns lately." Rolling Stone were unavailable for comment.

tylerw_sandbox, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 22:04 (nine years ago) link

ha

n/a, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 22:15 (nine years ago) link

i'm pretty surprised it took Donovan this long to get in, given the 60s bias of the HoF in general.

upper mississippi 2: still shakin, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 22:58 (nine years ago) link

Yeah, but a lot of people see Donovan as a lightweight.

jaymc, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 23:05 (nine years ago) link

yeah i spose i guess i felt like he had been critically "re-evaluated" but maybe that's more just in dork record collector circles

upper mississippi 2: still shakin, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 23:07 (nine years ago) link

All I read was the headline on the original link, so I didn't realize Donovan finally got in. Great--not sure I could make an objectively strong argument for him, but subjectively, in large part because of the way his music has been used in a half-dozen films, I've advocated for him on other threads. One of my favourites:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dj5IgoUtp8&feature=related

clemenza, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 23:09 (nine years ago) link

And yes--I'm a dorky record collector!

clemenza, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 23:10 (nine years ago) link

(as am I! donovan rules!)

upper mississippi 2: still shakin, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 23:31 (nine years ago) link

I think we can all agree that Donovan is better than the RHCP

Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 23:35 (nine years ago) link

has anyone ever seen this? starring donovan as ... the PIED PIPER.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f1NwhVRjyDk

tylerw_sandbox, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 23:38 (nine years ago) link

it's terrible

Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 23:38 (nine years ago) link

in an ocassionally amazing but mostly boring way

Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 23:38 (nine years ago) link

Lester Bangs: "But I can guarantee you one thing: we will never agree on anything as we agreed on the idea that Donovan is better than the Red Hot Chili Peppers."

clemenza, Wednesday, 7 December 2011 23:39 (nine years ago) link

So to sum up this thread,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBCq8XDgrP0

moodles, Thursday, 8 December 2011 02:05 (nine years ago) link

was hoping that the Cure would get in but knew it was a long shot. Donna Summer should not even be a question at this point. really thought Heart and Joan Jett and The Blackhearts would get in because this is in America. happiest about The Small Faces/The Faces.

Bee, Saturday, 10 December 2011 02:26 (nine years ago) link

Having engaged in a few such arguments over on ILB, all I can say is be careful what you wish for.

― clemenza, Wednesday, December 7, 2011 12:23 PM (2 days ago)

truly the best board on ILX :-)

Bee, Saturday, 10 December 2011 02:59 (nine years ago) link

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCFttHeq1NM
this one doesn't make the greatest hits either but I think it oughta

CaptainBurlapSax, Saturday, 10 December 2011 03:00 (nine years ago) link

Something that's neat is that Donovan's Facebook page is a regular one, where he posts and you can go on and comment (as opposed to the fan-club-type page). On his HOF post ("Truly honored"--hey, you're supposed to be British), 107 of us have chimed in with congratulations. (I know he's not exactly newsworthy in 2011, but I wouldn't have thought the total would be so low.)

clemenza, Saturday, 10 December 2011 03:08 (nine years ago) link

Faces should get totally drunk before accepting their award.

moonbop, Saturday, 10 December 2011 03:13 (nine years ago) link

A piece on Rush's snub, plus this list of others out in the cold:

Devo, X, Love, The Replacements, Motörhead, Roxy Music, Can, Big Star, Cheap Trick, Peter Gabriel, New Order, Joy Division, Thin Lizzy. Link Wray. Dick Dale.

New York Dolls, The Cars, Electric Light Orchestra, Bon Jovi, Gram Parsons, Kraftwerk, The Flaming Lips, The Pogues, Tammi Terrell, Warren Zevon.

Randy Newman, T. Rex, Stevie Ray Vaughan, The Smiths, Los Lobos, Dick Dale, Linda Ronstadt, Hall & Oates, Link Wray, The Monkees, MC5, Deep Purple.

Tumblr Whites Off Earth Now!! (Sandbox Grisso-McCain), Saturday, 10 December 2011 04:19 (nine years ago) link

man you could put together a pretty incredible festival of eligible but snubbed bands

some dude (Mr. Stevenson #2), Saturday, 10 December 2011 04:26 (nine years ago) link

I will no longer be sending my contributions...how can Heart not be in there. You just had an exibit devouted to the women of rock n roll yet still do not have arguably the most succesful (and talented) girl led band of all time in there. This is a travesty and and embarrasment. Not only did they have more then a few Top 10 hits but wrote all their own material...that's much more of an accomplishment then many of the women who are already in there.
Mike Trap | Wednesday, December 7: 9:31 a.m.

This blows!! Every year yawl induct some artist that ..although are noteworthy..do not fit the original profile for what the HOF is about.The Beastie Boys i can see,,,GNR..yeah..Laura Nyro? Does anyone remember her who wasnt a fan? What is the problem with NOT inducting THE MONKEES? They were the FIRST band to have a TV show...even if they were a product to begin with..they have had Many hit that continue to be played today...concerts sell out when they tour...come on...get off your high horse asses and give the people what THEY want for a change!!
russell joyner | Wednesday, December 7: 9:36 a.m.

Sad that the Hall of Shame continues to ignore a band that has had numerous consecutive gold & platinum records, and continues to sell out arenas. Guess the Hall of Shame is anti prog rock. Time to induct Rush!
Howard | Wednesday, December 7: 9:51 a.m.

Why does the Rock N Roll Hall of Fame keep passing on bands that should have been in the Hall of Fame a long time ago which are KISS, Rush & Deep Purple. Some of the acts that are in the Hall of Fame are more pop than Rock and Roll (ABBA is a BIG example). Get KISS in the Hall of Fame because they have been more of an influence on Rock and Roll than any that are being inducted next year. In fact, we would not have most bands today if it weren't for KISS. KISS is best and will always be.
George M. Shulock | Wednesday, December 7: 9:59 a.m.

Once again, Jethro Tull has been left out. Amazing. Reminds me of that the Baseball Hall of Fame did to Ron Santo. Are you going to wait for Ian Anderson to die?
David | Wednesday, December 7: 10:05 a.m.

t. silaviver, Saturday, 10 December 2011 04:47 (nine years ago) link

Truly shocked that Link Wray isn't in. I assumed he'd been inducted years -- decades -- ago. That's as blatantly oversighty as it gets.

Tarfumes the Escape Goat, Saturday, 10 December 2011 05:15 (nine years ago) link

Yeah, and I thought for some reason that T. Rex was in, too.

jaymc, Saturday, 10 December 2011 15:24 (nine years ago) link

Putting aside all the obvious problems with the HOF--pretending for a minute that all the inductees were well chosen--I always figured an American-voted HOF and a British-voted HOF wouldn't be identical. People who'd be in the latter but not the former might include T. Rex, Joy Division, the Jam, Nick Drake, etc. (The Jefferson Airplane would be a counter-example.)

clemenza, Saturday, 10 December 2011 15:35 (nine years ago) link

not mentioned in this thread: The Spinners and The Stylistics

gospodin simmel, Saturday, 10 December 2011 15:50 (nine years ago) link

Seriously Link Wray not being already in the HOF is crazy.

JacobSanders, Saturday, 10 December 2011 17:03 (nine years ago) link

HALL SO RONG

THAT'S LINK WRAY

THAT'S LINK WRAY

...THAT'S LINK WRAY

some dude (Mr. Stevenson #2), Saturday, 10 December 2011 17:26 (nine years ago) link

not mentioned in this thread: The Spinners and The Stylistics

The Spinners were at least nominated; the Stylistics never even got that far.

Tarfumes the Escape Goat, Saturday, 10 December 2011 17:45 (nine years ago) link

Moody Blues, anyone?

Mr. Snrub, Saturday, 10 December 2011 21:21 (nine years ago) link

The Replacements, Motörhead, Roxy Music, Can, Big Star, Cheap Trick, Peter Gabriel, New Order, Joy Division, Gram Parsons, Kraftwerk, The Flaming Lips, Randy Newman, Heart, T. Rex, Stevie Ray Vaughan, The Smiths

I'm amazed that the above got overlooked for Laura Nyro. If I hadn't read a biography of David Geffen, I would've never heard of Laura Nyro. I couldn't say the same for the rest.

musicfanatic, Sunday, 11 December 2011 02:59 (nine years ago) link

I always get Laura Nyro confused with Rykodisc.

rusty flathead screwdriver, Sunday, 11 December 2011 14:08 (nine years ago) link

Also, Alan Alda or Aldo Nova.

rusty flathead screwdriver, Sunday, 11 December 2011 14:12 (nine years ago) link

Alan Thicke or Robin Thicke

Lord Sotosyn, Sunday, 11 December 2011 14:14 (nine years ago) link

Possibly with Christgau's reviews lodged in the back of my mind, I assumed for years that I wouldn't care for Laura Nyro. (As a singer--"Wedding Bell Blues" I've loved forever.) But I quite like Gonna Take a Miracle, which I finally got a few years ago; recently bought Nested at a radio-station sale, and that's good too. I think it's exaggeration to put her in the HOF, but I like those two albums much more than I ever thought I would.

clemenza, Sunday, 11 December 2011 14:52 (nine years ago) link

Christmas and the Beads of Sweat is an alltime album for me, but it is hard to argue that Laura Nyro's importance exceeds that of Link Wray, Roxy Music, Deep Purple, etc. etc.

sean doily, Sunday, 11 December 2011 15:06 (nine years ago) link

For decades she had to deal with the stigma of having been booed at Monterey Pop, despite the fact that she wasn't. No one knows where this myth started, but it stuck with her even years after her death.

Tarfumes the Escape Goat, Sunday, 11 December 2011 15:45 (nine years ago) link

Will Roxy Music ever get in? I know they're not as innovative and influential as the RHCP...(eye roll)

Iago Galdston, Sunday, 11 December 2011 23:05 (nine years ago) link

At this rate Duran Duran will get in before either Chic or Roxy.

thewufs, Sunday, 11 December 2011 23:49 (nine years ago) link

Rob Sheffield is at Rolling Stone...

clemenza, Monday, 12 December 2011 00:11 (nine years ago) link

The Bee Gees got in before the Spinners, so yeah, it's a safe (and fucking depressing) assumption that Duran Duran will get in before Chic.

Tarfumes the Escape Goat, Monday, 12 December 2011 03:41 (nine years ago) link

there are analogies and there are just random names thrown around as if they have any concrete relationship to each othere

Mr. Stevenson #2, Monday, 12 December 2011 03:46 (nine years ago) link


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