if cain could only make a voting block out of the women he's allegedly harassed or with whom he's allegedly had affairs, he might have enough support to win the GOP nomination.
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 14:55 (twelve years ago) link
Sizable voting blocks:
Newt -- ex-wives.Huntsman -- people who thought, "Kurt Cobain?"
― clemenza, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:24 (twelve years ago) link
Obama-Gingrich debates would be fascinating
this is a new level of derangement
if Newt is nominated I will kiss all of yr asses is Macys window
― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:28 (twelve years ago) link
If Gingrich is leading NH polls ten days before the primary, look for amazingly timely, scandalous "revelations."
― Dr Morbius, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:32 (twelve years ago) link
Oh, come on--Obama and Gingrich would be amazing. Gingrich could say anything at any time, and Obama would be walking a tightrope--how much to hang back and let Gingrich destroy himself, but at the same time running the risk that Gingrich pounces (obviously Obama is vulnerable all over the place). Or if Obama debated aggressively, that would just increase the chance that Gingrich goes off.
― clemenza, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:33 (twelve years ago) link
I think I'm w/ you morbs but otoh the fact that romney still hasn't sealed this up might suggest that this might be an unusual primary
― iatee, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:34 (twelve years ago) link
dr. m is probably right, and that just tells you how little people are paying attention (because none of those possible "revelations" are actually new).
the thing is that the extent to which they'd damage gingrich at that point is largely dependent on the mood of the anyone-but-romney voting bloc at the time. if there's no alternative to gingrich (or at least none that could be settled upon in time), the "revelations" may not matter.
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:34 (twelve years ago) link
intrade has romney at 53.8%, newt at 30%
that's absurd I should go make some money off this
THAT'S CRAZY THERE IS NO MONEY TO BE MADE FROM POLITICS.
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:35 (twelve years ago) link
everyone knows this.
willing to suggest that there's *some* chance of this going all weird and romney not getting it, but 50%?
― iatee, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:36 (twelve years ago) link
btw, rick perry is now a populist
CarrieNBCNews Carrie Dann -- "You don't have to sit back & take it any more," "reach beyond the confines of the Beltway." Big push against "insiders" (read: Mitt/Newt)____________________________CarrieNBCNews Carrie Dann -- More Perry: "Americans were snookered" by "Wall Street highrollers" who were "betting against America." Harsher than usual.____________________________CarrieNBCNews Carrie Dann -- Populist Perry this AM in Nashua: "What's wrong with America can be diagrammed on a napkin... Straight line between DC and Wall St"
CarrieNBCNews Carrie Dann -- More Perry: "Americans were snookered" by "Wall Street highrollers" who were "betting against America." Harsher than usual.
____________________________
CarrieNBCNews Carrie Dann -- Populist Perry this AM in Nashua: "What's wrong with America can be diagrammed on a napkin... Straight line between DC and Wall St"
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:37 (twelve years ago) link
CarrieNBCNews Carrie Dann -- Populist Perry this AM in Nashua: "What's wrong with America can be diagrammed on a napkin... OOH I DREW A DOGGIE!"
― OH NOES, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:39 (twelve years ago) link
LOL
― Nicole, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 15:42 (twelve years ago) link
I sorta doubt Newt will pull ahead in NH but if so, yeah this is going to happen. Newt will never get the nomination, will probably limp through Iowa and NH and bank all his hopes on South Carolina.
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 17:30 (twelve years ago) link
If someone doesn't kick him in the nuts for this, we should just give ourselves back to Britain. His corporate whoredom is blatantly obvious.
― M. White, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 17:35 (twelve years ago) link
<i>Newt will never get the nomination, will probably limp through Iowa</i>
He may well get crushed in NH, but, barring sudden developments, it doesn't look like he'll be limping through Iowa. "Never"'s a strong word; the older I get, the less and less I'm inclined to speak in absolutes.
― clemenza, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 18:01 (twelve years ago) link
Square brackets--okay, now I get it.
― clemenza, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 18:02 (twelve years ago) link
Newt will never get the (GOP) nomination______________________________________"Never"'s a strong word; the older I get, the less and less I'm inclined to speak in absolutes.
______________________________________
"Never"'s a strong word; the older I get, the less and less I'm inclined to speak in absolutes.
i will go out on a limb and say the following people will never get the GOP nomination.
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 18:43 (twelve years ago) link
Never say never, but even among Republicans Newt's negative numbers are probably insuperable and even if they want to nominate someone who Obama is likely to beat, they'll want someone they actually like.
― M. White, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 18:47 (twelve years ago) link
i feel like newt will fuck this up and flame out at some point because he's newt gingrich and that's what he does.
― slandblox goole, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 18:48 (twelve years ago) link
Chamblis/Duffy '12
― OH NOES, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 18:49 (twelve years ago) link
i feel like newt cain perry will fuck this up and flame out at some point because he's newt cain perry and that's what he does.
― Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 18:50 (twelve years ago) link
naw, newt's actually got a chance here, especially if other non-romneys drop out of the race. he'll do pretty well in iowa and NH, and might do very well in south-carolina, where the south begins to roll.
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 18:53 (twelve years ago) link
NEWTNEWTNEWTNEWT
I wouldn't discount Abe Vigoda--Tessio was always smarter, and believe me, I know.
― clemenza, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 19:00 (twelve years ago) link
Tiffany's of NY is definitely in Newt's corner on this nomination thing.
― Aimless, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 19:03 (twelve years ago) link
I hope he uses "Breakfast at Tiffany's" as his campaign song.
― Nicole, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 19:10 (twelve years ago) link
The Freddie Mac thing has got to be thrown in his face. Perry is a ham-fisted hypocrite about the 'napkin diagram' but Newt is the ultimate Beltway insider and the Teabaggers and the Base have to decide whether even a shred of coherence is important to them. Personally, I'd like to see all their heads explode Scanners-style at the multitude of contradictions they presently contain.
― M. White, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 19:14 (twelve years ago) link
Frum's head has already exploded, evidently (that was a great piece btw, thx for the link upthread)
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 19:19 (twelve years ago) link
The Freddie Mac thing has got to be thrown in his face
don't shoot until you see the whites of their eyes (i.e., general election v. newt gingrich).
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 20:55 (twelve years ago) link
Bobby Moynihan is probably out distributing Newt fliers as we speak
― OH NOES, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 20:57 (twelve years ago) link
How can you not love him?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UU72izvZVRA
"I can't tell you what Speaker Gingrich is saying." I can only tell you what Speaker Gingrich is saying.
― clemenza, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 20:58 (twelve years ago) link
I love how the de facto GOP position is "round em up and deport em" as if that is a) moral, b) simple, c) inexpensive and d) a net benefit for the economy
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:10 (twelve years ago) link
their old position was "let them fry on an electrified fence with an alligator-infested moat dug around it," so this is an improvement.
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:11 (twelve years ago) link
in that it's only slightly less feasible eh I guess so
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:17 (twelve years ago) link
Josh Marshall thinks Newt-mentum may have legs:
http://talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/2011/11/mitts_darkening_horizon.php
― o. nate, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:18 (twelve years ago) link
I said this not as a partisan but as general advice. S/he who is (relatively, to him) w/o sin cast some mf'ing stones ppl!
― M. White, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:23 (twelve years ago) link
lol how badly did romney screw-up that FOX News interview?
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:28 (twelve years ago) link
Bring in the clowns...
― M. White, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:30 (twelve years ago) link
the clip above seems like yr standard Romney performance to me, but maybe I'm missing something.
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:32 (twelve years ago) link
they're ... all... rea...dy... heeeeeere
lol romney's answer on immigration question:
talk talk talk talk talk talk talk maybe he'll move on to something else talk talk talk talk talk talk talk
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:57 (twelve years ago) link
talk talk uh . . . you know . . . (nervous laughter) . . . uh talk talk
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:58 (twelve years ago) link
the lolsome part is that uh, aren't people who are here illegally already at the "back of the line" re: becoming legal
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 21:59 (twelve years ago) link
anyway, gingrich has a chance, because (a) he's an angry white guy who knows how to dog-whistle to his reactionary constituency (i.e., the GOP base) and (b) romney's No. 1 asset was the total, utter inability of his opponents to speak in coherent sentences and discuss even rudimentary policy, and -- as wrong as gingrich is on most issues -- he can speak full sentences and discuss policy.
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 22:00 (twelve years ago) link
basically, i'm willing to give amnesty to any undocumented person who can speak english better than rick perry.
which means amnesty for almost all of america's 11M undocumented persons.
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 22:01 (twelve years ago) link
anyway, gingrich has a chance, because (a) he's an angry white guy who knows how to dog-whistle to his reactionary constituency (i.e., the GOP base)
which means he has no chance of gaining independents, therefore he's lost the primaries.
― Lord Sotosyn, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 22:23 (twelve years ago) link
let me put it the way my favorite candidate, herman cain, would put it: I'M SORRY BUT YOU ARE WRONG..
I still think Mitt Romney is the likely Republican presidential nominee. But I don’t think, in the way I did a few months ago, that he’s the inevitable Republican nominee.Can Romney, under the right conditions, break out of the 20s, where he’s been stuck for almost the entire campaign? Sure. Jonathan Bernstein is persuasive on this point: Polls of Republicans show that Romney has low negatives and he performs well in hypothetical match-ups against other Republicans. But what if Romney faces the wrong conditions? The central mystery of the Republican primary is this: How can Romney’s support be so stable in a primary that’s so volatile? So far, we’ve seen a boom-and-bust cycle take Michele Bachmann, Rick Perry and Herman Cain from candidate to frontrunner to not-gonna-happen. But after each bust, Romney’s support was unchanged. He picked up none of their disappointed supporters. Now he’s trailing Newt Gingrich in the polls. Here, via TPM, is what that’s looked like in Iowa:(chart i can't print here)Ron Brownstein has come up with perhaps the best explanation for this. The Republican primary, he writes, has “become two races running along parallel but very distinct tracks.” One is the non-tea party primary. There, Romney is winning, and easily. The other is the tea party primary. There, Romney is losing, and big. Here’s the graph, which was published before Gingrich’s surge: (chart i can't print here)But ultimately, there’s really only one primary, and Romney needs more supporters if he’s going to win. And though Romney does not have a low ceiling, he clearly has a sticky floor. Republicans may not refuse to support him, but there’s strong evidence that a substantial number don’t want to support him. If Romney is inevitable, they’ll come around. But what if, at the wrong moment, Romney is not inevitable?Last night, Romney sat down for one of the first televised interviews he’s given in this campaign cycle. It was with a fairly friendly audience: Bret Baier of Fox News. And it was such a disaster that this morning, the Democratic National Committee released a video splicing together the reviews — many of them from Fox.(video i can't print here)Debates are a format that suits Romney well and his competitors poorly. So far, Romney hasn’t even stumbled. But eventually, he will stumble. Nobody runs a truly perfect campaign. So imagine Romney loses Iowa, as is very possible. And, under the strain of the loss, he gives a bad interview, or has a testy debate performance, right before New Hampshire. That might be all the excuse a critical number of New Hampshire voters need to coalesce around Gingrich, or perhaps the excuse that some resigned Romney supporters need to jump ship to Huntsman. And so Romney either loses New Hampshire or barely wins. And then he loses South Carolina.To be sure, Romney could, even under those circumstances, mount a comeback. As Nate Silver points out, there are eight weeks separating the New Hampshire primary from Super Tuesday. In 2008, there were merely three weeks. The 2008 calendar favored a momentum candidate like Gingrich, while the 2012 calendar favors a fundamentals candidate like Romney.Even so, Romney is having enough trouble adding supporters that he’s clearly vulnerable to a run of bad luck or bad news coming at the wrong time. And thus far, the primary has been so focused on a medium in which he shines — debates —that his flaws in interviews, his vulnerability to ads portraying him as a flip-flopper, and his weaknesses as a retail politician haven’t really been tested. Romney has looked so strong that even a slight stumble could be significant for a media that wants a horserace and voters who clearly want to support another candidate. So is Romney the likely nominee? Sure. Inevitable? No.
Can Romney, under the right conditions, break out of the 20s, where he’s been stuck for almost the entire campaign? Sure. Jonathan Bernstein is persuasive on this point: Polls of Republicans show that Romney has low negatives and he performs well in hypothetical match-ups against other Republicans. But what if Romney faces the wrong conditions?
The central mystery of the Republican primary is this: How can Romney’s support be so stable in a primary that’s so volatile? So far, we’ve seen a boom-and-bust cycle take Michele Bachmann, Rick Perry and Herman Cain from candidate to frontrunner to not-gonna-happen. But after each bust, Romney’s support was unchanged. He picked up none of their disappointed supporters. Now he’s trailing Newt Gingrich in the polls. Here, via TPM, is what that’s looked like in Iowa:
(chart i can't print here)
Ron Brownstein has come up with perhaps the best explanation for this. The Republican primary, he writes, has “become two races running along parallel but very distinct tracks.” One is the non-tea party primary. There, Romney is winning, and easily. The other is the tea party primary. There, Romney is losing, and big. Here’s the graph, which was published before Gingrich’s surge:
But ultimately, there’s really only one primary, and Romney needs more supporters if he’s going to win. And though Romney does not have a low ceiling, he clearly has a sticky floor. Republicans may not refuse to support him, but there’s strong evidence that a substantial number don’t want to support him. If Romney is inevitable, they’ll come around. But what if, at the wrong moment, Romney is not inevitable?
Last night, Romney sat down for one of the first televised interviews he’s given in this campaign cycle. It was with a fairly friendly audience: Bret Baier of Fox News. And it was such a disaster that this morning, the Democratic National Committee released a video splicing together the reviews — many of them from Fox.
(video i can't print here)
Debates are a format that suits Romney well and his competitors poorly. So far, Romney hasn’t even stumbled. But eventually, he will stumble. Nobody runs a truly perfect campaign. So imagine Romney loses Iowa, as is very possible. And, under the strain of the loss, he gives a bad interview, or has a testy debate performance, right before New Hampshire. That might be all the excuse a critical number of New Hampshire voters need to coalesce around Gingrich, or perhaps the excuse that some resigned Romney supporters need to jump ship to Huntsman. And so Romney either loses New Hampshire or barely wins. And then he loses South Carolina.
To be sure, Romney could, even under those circumstances, mount a comeback. As Nate Silver points out, there are eight weeks separating the New Hampshire primary from Super Tuesday. In 2008, there were merely three weeks. The 2008 calendar favored a momentum candidate like Gingrich, while the 2012 calendar favors a fundamentals candidate like Romney.
Even so, Romney is having enough trouble adding supporters that he’s clearly vulnerable to a run of bad luck or bad news coming at the wrong time. And thus far, the primary has been so focused on a medium in which he shines — debates —that his flaws in interviews, his vulnerability to ads portraying him as a flip-flopper, and his weaknesses as a retail politician haven’t really been tested. Romney has looked so strong that even a slight stumble could be significant for a media that wants a horserace and voters who clearly want to support another candidate. So is Romney the likely nominee? Sure. Inevitable? No.
― Daniel, Esq., Wednesday, 30 November 2011 22:28 (twelve years ago) link
it's true that Romney and Gingrich are the only two candidates that can, how you say, talk good
― Shakey Mo Collier, Wednesday, 30 November 2011 22:28 (twelve years ago) link