right, and this board has more than a few of 'em.
This seems really obvious to say, but it seems that a lot of emphasis needs to be on the psychology of these folks. There's a certain mindset that so cannot handle ambivalence of any sort, or any questioning, or any insecurity, that all things must be literal and straightforward. This shit is scary to some folks, so they have to cling to something. We've talked about this on other threads, too, like the one i did about authoritarian societies. The Bible must be read as literally true, even if it's been (mis)translated over the course of several languages, even if the first and second chapters of Genesis has differing versions of Creation, etc etc etc.
I suspect that somebody like Tep has a fair amount to say on this, but he tends to avoid these threads.
― kingfish in absentia (kingfish), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:14 (seventeen years ago) link
(I wonder how the Museum of Natural History deals with this sort of thing -- bet they have a script all laid out already for callers.)
― Michael Daddino (epicharmus), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:15 (seventeen years ago) link
xpost.
― horseshoe (horseshoe), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:16 (seventeen years ago) link
― kingfish in absentia (kingfish), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:18 (seventeen years ago) link
― Laurel (Laurel), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:19 (seventeen years ago) link
Right, but I don't know that it requires a particular sort of self-loathing to get to that point.
If you start downplaying Jesus' divinity or the literally cataloged powers of God the Father, you threaten the authority, the potency of the only pillar holding up their self-acceptance.
Replace "self-acceptance" with "overall sense of meaning in their lives," and I think it still works.
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:27 (seventeen years ago) link
I guess yelling "READ ONE BOOK" wouldn't be polite, would it?
― Leon Czolgosz (Leon), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:29 (seventeen years ago) link
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:33 (seventeen years ago) link
(b) if religion is there to shore us up against the idea that the universe is a cold, value-neutral place -- somewhere inside of this is a subissue, which is the usual belief among fundamentalists that the absence of religion means the absence of values, and a necessary descent into nihilism and greed and depravity. There's no faith that human beings could adopt positive values just on a rational basis, just at face value. (And this is something that plenty of strains of Christianity make a big deal of reinforcing, stressing that we are all stained and evil and fallen without God -- possibly even that you can't be a decent person without God, ten thousand Biblical exceptions aside.)
― nabisco (nabisco), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:36 (seventeen years ago) link
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:40 (seventeen years ago) link
XP: Whoops, forgot that extra "a"! Curse no mod powers on sandbox.
― Laurel (Laurel), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:40 (seventeen years ago) link
Nietzsche comes into play here, too, along with the massive historical misreadings given to him.
― kingfish in absentia (kingfish), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:41 (seventeen years ago) link
― Euai Kapaui (tracerhand), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:43 (seventeen years ago) link
that's a good question. Islam strikes me as less interested in love than Christianity is, but God's omnipotence and direct involvement in the world is certainly central.
― horseshoe (horseshoe), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:43 (seventeen years ago) link
Another question: how can people who have no problem with such a massive, weird abstraction have so much trouble with the idea of geological time?
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:46 (seventeen years ago) link
― Laurel (Laurel), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:48 (seventeen years ago) link
I.e. most of these folks don't talk too much about usury, or the forgiving of debts every so many years, or ignoring most of that whole "Sermon on the Mount" thing.
― kingfish in absentia (kingfish), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:49 (seventeen years ago) link
― My Mind is Opener than Yours (Modal Fugue), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:50 (seventeen years ago) link
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:52 (seventeen years ago) link
I'll give you $20 if you can remember that guy's name.
― nabisco (nabisco), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:54 (seventeen years ago) link
― Laurel (Laurel), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:54 (seventeen years ago) link
His name is That Douchebag. Pay up.
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:57 (seventeen years ago) link
xpost to Laurel.
― horseshoe (horseshoe), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:57 (seventeen years ago) link
― kingfish in absentia (kingfish), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:58 (seventeen years ago) link
― Laurel (Laurel), Monday, 4 December 2006 18:59 (seventeen years ago) link
I believe our beloved Prime Minister is down with it being taught in schools, if the price is right.
― My Mind is Opener than Yours (Modal Fugue), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:00 (seventeen years ago) link
Oh i figured, thus my disclaimer.
But something does need to be said that purported literalist readings usually have v.little to do w/ literally reading the other 90% of the book(s).
― kingfish in absentia (kingfish), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:01 (seventeen years ago) link
Dude's still on Comedy Central. Had a 1/2 hour thing after the Amazing Jonathan a few saturdays ago.
― kingfish in absentia (kingfish), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:03 (seventeen years ago) link
Wow. I didn't know anyone did that song and dance anymore. I thought the "pray and row for shore" model had taken over.
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:03 (seventeen years ago) link
― Euai Kapaui (tracerhand), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:03 (seventeen years ago) link
― Euai Kapaui (tracerhand), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:06 (seventeen years ago) link
― and what (ooo), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:07 (seventeen years ago) link
^^ HOTT
― and what (ooo), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:11 (seventeen years ago) link
― nabisco (nabisco), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:12 (seventeen years ago) link
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:14 (seventeen years ago) link
― My Life in the Ghosts of Bush (Modal Fugue), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:15 (seventeen years ago) link
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:15 (seventeen years ago) link
all this white girls are gunna show up on Burning Angel w/in 3 years, place yer bets
― kingfish in absentia (kingfish), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:16 (seventeen years ago) link
― and what (ooo), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:16 (seventeen years ago) link
This is pretty funny. I thought even fundies knew about inbreeding (they hate mormons right?).... but I thought most agreed with scientists about genetics.....
― jw (ex machina), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:17 (seventeen years ago) link
― and what (ooo), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:18 (seventeen years ago) link
― kingfish in absentia (kingfish), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:19 (seventeen years ago) link
― and what (ooo), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:22 (seventeen years ago) link
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:22 (seventeen years ago) link
― and what (ooo), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:23 (seventeen years ago) link
― whoop de doodle (kenan), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:23 (seventeen years ago) link
― Kenneth Branagh (gcannon), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:23 (seventeen years ago) link
― Euai Kapaui (tracerhand), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:23 (seventeen years ago) link
― and what (ooo), Monday, 4 December 2006 19:25 (seventeen years ago) link